Talk:Magical Girl (5e Class)
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I archived the old talk page, as the page recently underwent a major edit. Carry on. — Geodude671 (talk | contribs) . . 02:18, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
Hello there! I was not a big fan of Puella Magi Madoka Magica myself (that would be a friend of mine, though), but I find the concept interesting. However, here are some comments I'd like to share with you:
- Premise. Now, it is a big shame to start this, but personally, I do not find the premise of PMMM in general blends well with D&D mechanics. To be specific, I thought a variation of warlock makes a perfect PMMM-style magical girl, since you make a contract with Kyubey and gain magical power from the contract. If we're to make a separate class, I think there must be a specific mechanics that differs it from any other classes. My point of view is, the "vanilla" PMMM-style magical girl is too risky to be a D&D adventurer.
- I'm a kind of retro-maniac or even anachronistic kind of guy, so I thought the general concept of "magical girls who does both magical wonders and physical arse-kicking" would be a good start. That includes Sailor Moon, Pretty Cure, Cutie Honey, Cardcaptor Sakura, Tokyo Mew Mew, and many others. (Funny though, I thought I was not a big fan of magical girl genre...) That would make a hypothetical magical girl would be a half-level or a third-level spellcaster, with a decent combat abilities, not unlike a ranger or paladin.
- Wish Point. Not only is this unconventional for D&D resource mechanics, it's uselessly big in numbers. From my point of view, the beauty of tabletop games is having numbers as small as possible, to keep a difference of 1 or 2 interesting all the time.
- Soul Gem. We all know the golden rule that goes without saying: "If you stat it, they will kill it." Giving a stat to Soul Gem will definitely make it vulnerable to any outer harms. Plus, I am well aware that Soul Gem is the most important artifact in PMMM universe, but in D&D universe, it's more or less a phylactery for liches. Instead of complex mechanics, I think there must be a simpler way to make it distinguishable from other sources, while being mechanically cleaner.
- Magical Outfit. There is no "in combat" and/or "out of combat" in 5th edition, so this is an obvious point to revise. Magic Property Slot sounds like an MMORPG feature, which does not blend well with D&D mechanics. Plus, the AC is very unusual for D&D standards, I think 10 plus Dexterity modifier plus Charisma modifier would do.
- Soul Weapon. I thought warlock's Pact of the Blade feature makes a perfect Soul Weapon feature, instead of the current version.
- Dream Harvest. Why does the creatures you killed drop Dream Seeds? PMMM justified it in a very interesting ways, but the mechanics here seems a bit... forced, to ensure that a magical girl can replenish her (it's "her", right?) Wish Points at the end of each combat. Plus, there is no defined "encounter" in 5th edition, it sounds more of 4th edition.
- Magical Archetype. The current version is a bit meh for an archetype. It just makes you either a spellcaster, a dedicated fighter, or a bowgirl. My idea is more of a nature of wielding magical power, rather than the combat style: For example, some may use their magical power for protecting others, while some will be more than willing to use it all for their own benefits. I think wizard's Arcane Tradition would be a good example for determining the style.
- Meek. I don't really get this feature in general. So as long as you don't attack others, others won't attack or even suspect you as a hostile threat at all? That's kinda... forcing others' roleplaying, isn't it?
- Incubator's Power. Flying speed, hoo boy. Note that flying speed is the most powerful moving speed in the game, so there must be a strong restriction in this. By 20th level, you can fly up to 80 feet per round, which is too fast.
- Void Shell. For starters, the truth can be out before a magical girl reach 5th level, or never at all. (In PMMM, Madoka learns the truth before she was even a magical girl. Oops, spoiler alert.) This feature forces the storyline, which is something DM and players must come up with, not the rules.
- Personally, I don't think the zombie-style feature is not exactly appropriate, even for PMMM standards. I mean, Sayaka used this to full potentials, but she didn't walk like zombies, did she? I think there must be an easier way to solve this.
- Savior/Hollow. Helper? Pounder? What?
- Oh, so now I have another resources called "the cleanliness point"? Plus, it's another combat boost feature, which seems to come up a lot for a magical girl, which I suspected would do much wonders in combats and non-combat situations.
- Emotion. A loonie would be more than happy to deliberately killing off allies to use this feature! I think the premise of this feature is too risky for a feature.
- Weapon Cloning. If this is in order to emulate Mami's gunfire stuff, I don't think it emulates the scene effectively, since you will still be bound by the combat rules. Although it would be an inferior copy of your weapon, it still does a maximum damage of whopping 5d4 plus five times your ability modifier at a single turn, which is more than enough.
- Magical Outfit Upgrade. If this is changed to 10 plus Dexterity modifier plus Charisma modifier as I suggested above, this feature would be more or less obsolete.
- Monstrous Rampage. "Husk-Like Body"? Where did this come from?
- Soul Weapon Upgrade. Additional damage die? Too strong. Does this apply to Weapon Cloning as well? If it does, hoo boy, it's simply overpowered.
- Ultimate Attack. A rather bland AoE attack feature, too bland for magical girls. I was expecting something... flashy, really.
- Soul Crystal. Again, since "if you stat it, they will kill it", it would be better to leave the Soul Gem without any stat in the first place.
- Magcial Blessing. A tragically JRPG-esque feature. It's also combat-oriented feature, nothing more, nothing less. I mean, there must be more of magical girls than simple, mindless arsekicking.
- Witch Formation. Another combat feature? Please, this is the capstone feature, I think something more than a simple, "powerful" combat feature would be more appropriate.
- Magical Paradise. So basically it's the demiplane spell?
- Multiclassing. Prerequisites are almost always 13, and you rarely get a single skill proficiency from multiclassing.
In short: I'm afraid I don't think the current version of magical girl is either interesting or balanced at all. To me, it seems more of a "flying fighting girl" than a "magical girl". I think what it really lacks is an interesting fluff that can differ the class from mindless killfest that is not exactly what magical girls are supposed to be, even to PMMM standards. --WeirdoWhoever (talk) 07:40, 9 June 2017 (UTC)
Group Tactics[edit]
Would a group of Magical Girls be called a Sailor Moon Corps? --Redrum 18:41, 18 October 2017 (MDT)
- Not the writer, but yes.
Copyright Disclaimer[edit]
You should throw in a Copyright Disclaimer
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—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Varkarrus (talk • contribs) . Please sign your posts.
- I'm not too familiar with PMMM, but the concept of a Magical Girl is not unique to them. I don't know how closely this class sticks to the franchise, but I think this might be all right without a copyright disclaimer. — Geodude671 (talk | contribs | email) . . 16:19, 19 October 2017 (MDT)
- I would recommend you direct that question to Umbra Lux, since he (?) was the one who brought the page to its current state. — Geodude671 (talk | contribs | email) . . 12:41, 19 December 2017 (MST)
Old And Busted[edit]
Near as I can tell, this class has been abandoned for around three years. I think it's really interesting and has a lot of potential. Unfortunately, I have neither the time nor knowledge to fix it up by myself. If one or more people more experienced than me would like to help me make this class game-worthy, please do. --Amalgamation (talk) 11:32, 4 January 2021 (MST)
- I'm a fan of Madoka Magica and I also think it's an interesting idea. I'm a new user but I want to try and rework this class and make it game-worthy. I don't even know if I needed to even ask permission or if I need to get an admin but I might as well try. --Captainblade138 9:41, 23 February 2021 (EST)
- You don't need permission to edit almost any page. If you think you can improve the thing, go for it, but try not to go too crazy. Working on a class can be a rather big undertaking, pace yourself if you need to. --SwankyPants (talk) 07:49, 23 February 2021 (MST)
I tried and need some feedback[edit]
I'm trying to Rework this class and some feedback would be helpful at this time I'm still working on many things and am not done but if someone could give me feedback on what I got so far would be very helpful.--Captainblade138 (talk) 11:49, 1 March 2021 (MST)
Collection of Thoughts[edit]
I figure I'll make a new section for this, since I've got a good few. Sorry for leaving you out in the dark for so long here, just never really got to this.
- This class sure has a lot of features. A lot. Doesn't help that all of them are incredibly wordy.
- For all the fluff in the features, there's very little outside of it. Could really use some more at the top.
- The lack of subclasses is strange, as it seems to be using a system like it for things like Savior/Hollow, or Magical Archetype. These should probably be split into actual subclasses, or maybe a different, more versatile system, like tiered invocations or something.
- There's plenty of needless bits just sprinkled in for no clear reason. A lot of this extra fluff is either dependent on the player or the setting, and even if it's based on something, it probably shouldn't be this heavy. There's quite a few examples, like:
- Soul Gem, with "You've made your wish and now your soul resides within a special item we call a "Soul Gem." This can take the shape of either a Necklace, a Ring, an Earring, or even nowhere at all and just hide it in your chest or wherever inside your body you want", and " (also if you took the body willingly this implies that you and that person will technically share a body with you taking main control you can use it for roleplay or something but this gives no other abilities other than character development and extra roleplaying.)"
- Void Shell, "You find out the truth about your body, learning that your body has no soul, and has since been operating more like a zombie following orders. The thought horrifies you initially, but you can use this new knowledge to your benefit."
- Unstable Emotions, "This mental disease you call "Emotion" holds quite some power in your world. "Mental Disease, you ask?" That's what The Incubator calls it. "
- Reinforced Magical Outfit, "The control of your Soul Gem stabilized enough to make your defense tough as it can be, your Outfit to look a little different (If you desire), and looks more "normal" average folk."
- Most of these could really benefit from a bit of trimming, maybe going from all that to just a short sentence. Anyways.
- A lot of the wording could benefit from being cleaned up, both the mechanics and lore, and made more concise. Alongside this, much of the bracketed information shouldn't be, or shouldn't need to be.
This was just from my first lookover in a little while. I can give more specific tips if need be, but my general advice is to look at other preexisting classes that work well. For a good set of them, take a peek through this guy's user page(the finished ones, not those left on the userpage), as he's made and reworked many, and I can guarantee any on there are fairly high quality. Good luck with this page, man! --SwankyPants (talk) 11:42, 28 April 2021 (MDT)
Praise[edit]
I just wanted to say that I’m so happy it’s still being updated, and look forward to seeing all the new things! I see a lot of criticism, but even 10 months ago I loved the class and think your doing great. I have even played a character with it! Oh, and 1 question before I go.
When you fail a body take over, and take that 1d6 psychic damage, does that go to your soul gem? I’m confused. I thought the idea of a failed take over could act as a failed death save, and makes you gone. And then a target just has to make 3 saving throws or something, to balance that. Ans what happens if you fail the doppel save?
Again, great work, keep it up! (And I like the WP system. Numbers and all)
Constitution saving throw (DC=25) to see if you pass out or not from the physical and mental stress you went through, if you do pass out you'll be passed out for an entire day. if I need to work on wording it better then let me know. sorry i haven't been updating the class BTW I had some things in real life but I'm back
watchlist[edit]
Could someone keep an eye on the IP that put the anime is for children and pedophiles comment on the main page? Redrum (talk) 17:23, 29 December 2021 (MST)
More Discussion of Balance[edit]
I know this class hasn't been worked on in seemingly a decent amount of time, so I'll keep this brief. The class as it is currently is HUGE. Lots of blocks of text, very little that is balanced or given an interesting twist. I feel like this should be given another look, maybe dragged further away from Madoka Magika, maybe following a few of the suggestions from the discussion page here. Once I finish working on some of the classes I am working on, I might come and see about editing this to, at the very least, be easier to digest. Oh, and also not turn you into a 1050 hp, +12 to hit, 21d6 3x per round monster at level 20. KrimsonLord (talk) 00:09, 10 October 2023 (MDT)
