Talk:Stylvix (5e Race)

Musicus Meter Score: 7

This race has a score of 7 according to the Musicus Meter race guidelines. With this metric, first-party races' scores range from 4.5 to 8. This is a guideline, not a rule, and it's important to use your own judgment alongside this scoring.

This scoring may be the groundwork for a focused {{needsbalance}} usage. A contributor to this page may request a detailed breakdown of this page's balance. Without this information, {{needsbalance}} may then be removed. This meter cannot be the sole basis for a needsbalance template, but may be included as an accessory to a wider discussion of a race's balance.

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Stylvix

Cost	Racial Trait
2	Dexterity score increases by 2.
3	Labored Flight (40 Feet).
0.5	Darkvision.
0.5	Talons 1d4.
2	Feather Arrows.
-1	Cannot fly while wearing medium or heavy armor.
7	Total.

Questions

When I saw the Discord comments I thought I’d help but I don’t see glaring things unless you consider this being min/maxes potentially. A few questions I thought of while reading it though is:

• why no common language? Lived thousands of years on the material plane but never learned this? You said they’re secluded to forests but typically elves are too and dwarves to mountains and both have learned common.
• no races know them except aarakocra? Elves, masters of forestry aren’t familiar with them? Centaurs neither? Did Decidueye inherently know Sylvan?
• the phobias are part of their mechanics but i get no lore from it. Between this and point one, I ask the question is this being min/maxed.
• The cowl is a free longbow but without it you can’t fire your feather arrows. What if someone wanted to play a Decidueye that didn’t pass the ritual? Or, is every PC assumed to have passed? 0_o

From the lore I get a sense of advantage on acrobatics/athletics while in trees, not really a flying vibe. An ability to survive harshest winters and toughest summers, but no mechanics. And since you brought it up, how does one become a Silent Wing? I see how to be eligible but such a prominent role as it sounds has no mention other than assigning mundane tasks to failed ritualists and determining the strongest creature to defeat. A very well written race in my opinion. Just a few inconsistencies. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 18:43, 25 February 2018 (MST)

Hello, BigShotFancyMan!

Alrighty, time to address some questions!

• The reason why they don't speak common is for two reasons. The first of which (which probably isn't explained all that well in the lore) is that Decidueye almost never interact with humanoids, if not ever. They have no need to learn Common, a language used by humanoids to trade and converse with each-other. They find solace in getting the resources needed to survive themselves and find great comfort in their secluded forest world that they've created for themselves. The second reason is more of a balancing opinion, as I wanted to add a small nerf that wouldn't hinder the Decidueye's abilities in combat but would also add a fun roleplaying hurdle to make Decidueye players find unique ways to communicate with their fellow party members. I don't want to change this part of the race at all.

• This might be changed in the lore. It's not a matter of IF they exist, it's just that they're so secluded from modern society that they're never encountered at all by those unfamiliar with the forest and rarely seen by Fey and other forest creatures. That's gonna be first on my to-do list, with your other questions being answered in the flavor text as well.

• This will also be covered far more in the lore. I tried hinting at it subtly in the lore, but I guess I failed at making it obvious. Be on the lookout for something that addresses this in the Society section! :)

• If someone wanted to play a Decidueye that failed the Feather Ritual, they would have very limited access to the Feather Arrow feature. They would be able to use the Feather Arrows either by obtaining a cowl through unethical means (stealing, ect.) or simply going without the feature all together. I want to keep the mechanics of the Feather Arrow feature as they are as well. I'll probably add some flavor about the properties of the Feather Arrows and how they can't be fired through normal means.

• In terms of the "harshest of winters" and "toughest summers" parts of the lore, you're absolutely right. I was just having fun writing and I wasn't planning on adding it to the Decidueye race's mechanics. What I WILL be working on, however, is describing the role of the Silent Wing and what it entails in much greater detail.

Thank you so much for the pointers and the compliment! I have a really busy week ahead of me, so I may not be able to address these in the speedy fashion I usually do, But I can assure you I'm SUPER excited to entertain you with my writing! :)

EpicBoss99 (talk) 20:54, 25 February 2018 (MST)

Race To-Do List

Hello, readers! This is what I have planned next for this race! I thought i'd make it into a list for everyone to see so that questions may be answered! These changes are currently in the works as of right now, so please wait until these items have been completed before adding templates to the main page.

To-Do List 1 (February-March 2018)

• "Decidueye as Adventurers" Section
• Paragraph on Silent Wings in "Society" Section Complete! (See Paragraph 4 of Society Section)
• "Decidueye Language" paragraph in "Society" Section Complete! (See Paragraph 3 of Society Section)
• Decidueye Flight and Wings described further in opening paragraph and Physical Description section. Complete! (See Intro Paragraph and Paragraph 1 of Physical Description Section)

Hello, again! I've completed everything that I feel like needed to be done, so I'm declaring the race to be complete! If you have any feedback now that it's complete, feel free to make a comment here on the talk page! Big thanks to BigShotFancyMan, ConcealedLight, Geodude671, and Blobby383b for the inspiration, encouragement, constructive criticism, and suggestions that they've given me on the D&D Wiki Discord! I really appreciate y'all! :) --EpicBoss99 (talk) 00:44, 3 March 2018 (MST)

Feather Arrows

“You have the strange but powerful ability to fire your own feathers as arrows. During a short or long rest, you can create 2d4 sharpened arrows made from your own feathers. As an Action, you can use your cowl to make a ranged attack with an arrow you’ve made, adding your Dexterity modifier and proficiency bonus to the attack roll. Your feather arrows deal 1d8 + your Dexterity modifier piercing damage. While you are flying, attacking with your feather arrows only requires a bonus action.”
I find this grammar and phrasing more in line with 5e. It also eliminates the need to give longbow proficiency (not that I’m against it) and doesn’t let any feats that effect longbows stack with it, although it would still benefit from anything buffing ranged attacks. Again, another thing I find more in line with natural attacks. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 14:23, 29 May 2018 (MDT)

Sweet! I appreciate it! I'm gonna take what you did and condense it just a little bit. It's still going to do the same thing but grammatically it'll be a little shorter. Also, I wanted to add a range to it as well. Thanks again for your help! :) --EpicBoss99 (talk) 17:20, 29 May 2018 (MDT)

---

— This article did not become a featured article. 08:28, 14 September 2018 (MDT)
Please feel free to re-nominate it once it meets the FA criteria and when all the major issues brought up in this nomination have been dealt with.

Hello!

It's EpicBoss99 again. So after my failed attempt with the avilus race, I wanted to work on a project that I could call my masterpiece. Since I created the Decidueye race in December, I have poured my heart and soul into this race like no other page that I've made in the past. I really wanted to create a work that would challenge my abilities in writing and push myself to learn and grow. This race has been through multiple edits and has been looked over by multiple people that I really look up to on this site (and have written Featured Articles before). I feel like the decidueye race can be a fantastic addition to D&D Wiki as a Featured Article due to the way that it provides veteran role-players with a fun challenge and adds a flavorful twist to player interaction without forcing it to halt game-play. It also adds a different kind of flavor to what is normally defined as a flying race. I would be so incredibly grateful if this work, the hardest I've ever worked on a piece of creative writing, was made into a Featured Article on my favorite website. Thank you, and I can't wait to see your feedback as always! :D

--EpicBoss99 (talk) 14:07, 12 March 2018 (MDT)

(2/3) 40% Approval

Support

• See above! :D --EpicBoss99 (talk) 14:07, 12 March 2018 (MDT)

Support

• I wasn't initially sure about this race as a featured article, a high flying speed as well as not being able to speak Common are both rather taboo aspects and for good reason too. However, over several months User:EpicBoss99 has worked to improve this race from both a flavor and mechanical standing. He has addressed both those taboos eloquently and produced a high-quality page worthy of being called a featured article. In short, I'm proud, you did good and I fully support this article. --ConcealedLight (talk) 03:28, 25 May 2018 (MDT)

Oppose

• I feel terrible doing this, since I love EpicBoss like a comrade, but I think that the page length is just too long to be a featured article. I think that the page should be shortened, and then it will be good to go :) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by GamerAim (talk • contribs) . Please sign your posts.

Where specifically can stuff be cut down? This was a passion project of mine so I do admit I went kinda nuts when it comes to how much I wrote.
EpicBoss99 (talk) 13:14, 30 May 2018 (MDT)

Honestly? I'd cut it down everywhere. Any section with more than two paragraphs, cut it down to two. Any section with two paragraphs, cut each paragraph in half size. I do not mean to sound discouraging! I appreciate the passion that went into it <3 --GamerAim (talk) 13:47, 30 May 2018 (MDT)

Oppose

I've already said why before. I strongly disapprove of the Feathered Arrows and Leafy Cowl trait that heavily shoehorn the race into being a bow-using race, lest they miss out on the most benefits from their traits. But, I also heavily disagree with GamerAim and BSFM: the page is absolutely not too long! Honestly, this should be the gold standard for featured article lore. Varkarrus (talk) 10:12, 7 July 2018 (MDT)

Yeah at this point I’m just going to copy/paste the traits I made for my decidueye race because it seems that’s the only thing holding this race back. Feather Arrows and Leafy Cowl have been troublesome for almost everyone, so i almost might be a little happy seeing them go. :) EpicBoss99 (talk) 10:31, 7 July 2018 (MDT)

My vote is still Oppose for now... there's just One Last Thing that needs fixing up before I will switch to a support (and I really do want to support it!) The Labored Flight trait is Far less powerful than unrestricted flight as it requires an action to use, negating the main reason why flight is so powerful as a racial trait (which is, the ability to attack while flying.) As Feathered Arrows no longer negates this weakness, this means the Musicus score should be updated appropriately, and will assuredly mean the Stylvix can fit in another 1-1.5 point value trait. Varkarrus (talk) 15:04, 9 July 2018 (MDT)

Oppose - What has been on my mind for at least a month: I don't even know what this is trying to be. I understand FANs can be changed based on FAN discussion but this page was renamed or moved or I can't remember. It faces numerous changes sporadically, I just don't know what I am reviewing. This page also way more text than I would support for a FA. I wouldn't think shortening each section by 2-3 sentences would lose the flavor, design, and spirit of the page. this is but one opinion, and not a fun one to give BigShotFancyMan (talk) 21:06, 8 July 2018 (MDT)

I can revert the entire page to the point where Concealed approved it, if you'd like. I've been making every change that's been thrown at me, so I can see how it's getting a little unstable. This page has brought me more stress than anything else, so I kinda wanna see where it goes without making any more changes. I have until September, so I'm not giving up on this page until the very end. EpicBoss99 (talk) 21:52, 8 July 2018 (MDT)

That is an option and your choice, but I don't think I "support"-ed it when ConcealedLight did, so with that. what I'd like has been said, a little stability with the page and less reading. I think it has been said less lore is a "dumb idea" and I haven't suggested removing the lore, just the amount of text. Can the flavor, design, and spirit be maintained without a few ideas? That is up to you. Mind you, maybe others who like the "fluff" would oppose this for not meeting the what should be in their opinion "the gold standard" *shrug*. I don't know. I've only shared my opinion, it is not fact! BigShotFancyMan (talk) 06:59, 9 July 2018 (MDT)

I'll see what I can do. Thanks again. EpicBoss99 (talk) 12:47, 9 July 2018 (MDT)

Comment

• How is the image licensed? --Green Dragon (talk) 10:41, 13 March 2018 (MDT)

Oh, man!! After all that time proofreading this article, that's the one thing I didn't pay attention to! Okay, on Thursday morning (when I have access to my computer again) I'm gonna re-format that so there isn't any copyright issues! Thanks for pointing that out!! :) --EpicBoss99 (talk) 13:21, 13 March 2018 (MDT)

Alrighty! Just got that image updated (that fits the opening paragraph pretty nicely ;D) with a credible source as well! Sorry for the delay! :) --EpicBoss99 (talk) 19:08, 15 March 2018 (MDT)

Comment - For starters, I don't think the issue of the feather ritual was really addressed. If you fail, you have to steal a cowl even if you are good dude? just to use a trait?
Maybe others can comment, but there's an uneasy feeling I have about a FA with Design Disclaimer stating its not meant for beginners. More importantly though, what about this race makes combat difficult? I don't find the DD necessary.
I think it would be better if the cowl can use the feathers to make ranged attacks instead of saying it is treated as a longbow.
The phobias kill me. DUNGEONS & Dragons. Yet this race has a huge nerf to the whole dungeon thing. This race is really only useful in "small" cities or wilderness. I honestly believe them to be here only to lower a musicus score. (based on Discord discussions/comments/questions) and there's better place for them, see below.
Wings don't allow this race to use bows or heavy crossbow. Only a light xbow. seems counter productive for a flying race, lest you are a mage.
Lore-cowl is made and worn through life but only by those who complete the feather ritual. this could answer my strife from earlier, that they make the cowl at a young age but aren't allowed to wear. if they fail, they're outcast so who cares if they wear the cowl then?
Decidueye as adventurers-I think I am being picky and expecting too much of a semblance to precendent-players are referred to in traits where as the lore refers to the race. (looking through PHB lore, you and your are not used unless depicting the traits used) again, perhaps I am being too picky. I understand why you've included this block since there are a many conflicts when choosing this race. As this block continues, and talks about the phobias, why aren't these flaws instead of core traits to the race? The suggestions to ask your DM to a certain way to appease this race's issue would be met with a stern no. Don't play a race that requires a magical item to be beneficial to the group. If you want to suggest a level be attained, include in the traits, not put it on the player/DM. This goes along with suggesting to take a feat to learn common to overcome language barriers. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 01:30, 7 April 2018 (MDT)

Okay, I get it. There shouldn't be too many changes, but later tonight I'm going to go back through the entire page and change everything that is needed to satisfy your requests. --EpicBoss99 (talk) 18:48, 7 April 2018 (MDT)

Alright, I made a few changes. More changes to come soon! :) --EpicBoss99 (talk) 09:46, 9 April 2018 (MDT)

Comment

Hello, everyone! I just wanted to give a quick update in regards to this page. I'm very excited about getting started on the changes once again for this page, and those changes will most likely be posted on May 8th. Thanks again for everyone's feedback, and I hope all of you enjoy what I have planned! :)

--EpicBoss99 (talk) 11:10, 2 May 2018 (MDT)

Looking forward to the changes, so that we can get this page featured. One idea would be to allow them to fire their feathers and "fly" in a single round, while removing their inherent flight. Alternatively, include various flight benefits as subclass features. Then, you could make a variant feature that grants them flight. You may also want to add some Pokémon evolution type-ideas. --Green Dragon (talk) 08:58, 3 May 2018 (MDT)

I really like those ideas, Green Dragon! I do however have to say that it may take more time to edit this page than I thought because of how busy I am, so I'm hoping to get this page done by the end of the week! :) --EpicBoss99 (talk) 00:13, 10 May 2018 (MDT)

Comment

Okay! After a small hiatus from this page, it's finally finished! I've addressed everything that's been previously mentioned before, and I feel really great about where this page is now! I feel like I've come a very long way thanks to you guys's help, and I'd love to hear your feedback on this new version! The Musicus Meter has also been updated! :) --EpicBoss99 (talk) 01:31, 25 May 2018 (MDT)

Comment

Alright! I've been getting some fantastic critiques on the Discord, so I'm going to be making VERY significant changes to this page, including changing the name, appearance, and features! Be on the lookout for changes, and I can't wait to see what y'all think! Thanks again to those that left feedback here as well! :)
EpicBoss99 (talk) 12:02, 31 May 2018 (MDT)

Let us know when this is implemented. I have some questions about the race too. For example, Feathered Arrows would be very hard to roleplay. Maybe this could be toned down, also to balance this race. Talons are worse than a normal unarmed strike, so maybe change them? --Green Dragon (talk) 09:33, 18 June 2018 (MDT)

Thanks again for your feedback, Green Dragon! I definitely agree that I need to change the Talons trait. Once I can get something together on Discord that everyone likes, I'm gonna make huge changes to this page, including rewording the Feather Arrows trait and the Talons trait. :D --EpicBoss99 (talk) 23:54, 22 June 2018 (MDT)

Playtesting Huzzah

This page is currently being playtested for balance of its current features, I ask that anyone refrain from changing the pages content until playtesting has completed. If there are edits which a user feels needs immediate address please contact me before making said changes. Thank you for helping us make Dnd Wiki a safe place for all content! -- Cotsu Malcior (talk) 16:41, 30 August 2018 (MDT)