Talk:Space Marine (5e Race)

Room for Improvement

This, overall, isn't too great. While it is certainly thematic, yes, as genetically enhanced super religious super soldiers, it doesn't really do a majority of the chapters justice, namely the traitor legions. Specifically, I have issues with the speed, the religion proficiency, and the language. On the tabletop, all marines have a 6" move, the exact same as guardsmen(regular people), and are generally shown to be, even in armor, really fast. Secondly, religion proficiency works until you think about it a little harder. Generally, at least in the 41st millenium, regular space marines are super religious, probably just as religious as 30k Word Bearers, however, this, to my knowledge, only extends to their religion. The religion skill tends to be a coverall, something that doesn't work as well when applied to this situation. Finally, Orks do not have a specific language, I think, and even then, why would any space marine learn to communicate with the things they kill on sight? There are other issues, but these lead me to believe that this page needs a reworking.

However, I wouldn't be posting this if I didn't have any idea how to fix it, would I?

Here's what I'm thinking. Essentially, we make a subrace for all 18 first founding legions. Additionally, we could have pre-heresy versions of the traitor legions. In this way, this race could cover almost every chapter, using the geneseed origin for successors, and allowing loyalist traitor successors to be functional(i.e Blood Ravens are Thousand Sons successors), without too much additional screwery.

Statwise, I say we don't give them too much on the base. A +2 to Strength, +1 to Constitution probably, with Relentless Endurance(or maybe not and this is a DG post heresy exclusive), and Powerful Build. However, this allows us to do more interesting stuff with the subraces. For them, I was thinking of a +1 to a specific stat(Intelligence for TS, Charisma for WB, Dexterity for Smurfs), and then a few more minor things, like a tool proficiency for Iron Warriors and Imperial Fists, Stealth proficiency for Raven Guard and Night Lords, and a damage resistance for Salamanders and Death Guard. Maybe if we stick to 1-1.5 on the minor stuff(Musicus wise), we get a rough score of 6.5-7, which is pretty reasonable.

I'm not sure on what we would swap it out with for 30k, but we could also give all the 40k loyalists a sorta stonecunning just for things relating to the Lectitio Divinatatus(the book lorgar wrote), but I'm not sure.

I'd like to hear your thoughts on this, I likely haven't done the best job explaining so further communication might help. --SwankyPants (talk) 07:29, 10 November 2020 (MST)

It is definitely bland. From what I skim off the 40k wiki, they are essentially humans bordering superhuman. Legions separating them sometimes have differences in equipment, belief or temperament more so than skills. In all honesty this is able to be played well by just a human variant. If you really wanted to, you could stretch the subrace idea a bit to a small ASI and like one feat each. After all, some of the legions have very minute differences like their trademark vehicles or fashion choice only (as far as I skim). I'm not familiar with 40k past tyranids so maybe someone else has a more developed idea.--Yanied (talk) 08:19, 10 November 2020 (MST)

Eh, I'd say at least two. Iron Hands and White Scars both love their vehicles, but reducing it to "vehicle proficiency" kinda does them both a disservice. WS love going fast, and IH just prefer mechanical stuff in general, and by adding slightly more, they can still feel different, if only slightly. --SwankyPants (talk) 11:36, 11 November 2020 (MST)

Mostly Complete Rework

Well, turns out I didn't really go through with any of the above ideas. Since I'm actually more familiar with the game now(if only through battlescribe and stuff), I've decided to fix it through the way custom chapters are implemented(i.e pick two things). A lot of the traits probably need some rebalancing, but it's now in a better state than it was before. --SwankyPants (talk) 22:00, 3 March 2021 (MST)