Talk:Poop-Slinger (3.5e Feat)

Of course this is juvenile. That's why I listed it as an April Fools article in the first place. I could understand this article being proposed for deletion if I was serious about the entire thing, but if it's listed as a joke, people should try taking it as a joke. Who besides the most obnoxious of Dungeon Masters is going to use this? PokeDM

When it comes down to it, though, it's just not all that funny. I'm glad to hear any other opinions on the matter, but I just don't see scatological humor having a place here. JazzMan 16:20, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

Yes, but if there wasn't a place for it at all, why would I have sent it in the first place? Besides, not everyone thinks some of the other humor on the April Fools section is funny either. PokeDM

if there wasn't a place for it at all, why would I have sent it in the first place?

That's kind of the point of this discussion. You entering the article doesn't automatically make there a place for it on this wiki. I certainly don't think you did it with ill intention or anything, but the point of the delete template is to signify when one editor believes the work by another editor does not belong.

Besides, not everyone thinks some of the other humor on the April Fools section is funny either

The main problem with this argument is that existence of other non-compliant material is not valid as an argument to keep this non-compliant material. See Wikipedia:Other Stuff Exists. Secondly, I'm not really objecting to the fact that I don't find it funny (everyone's entitled to their own sense of humor), but rather to the low-brow nature of the humor. I mean, flinging poop? Really? I would hope that we are more classy than that.

As it is though, nobody else seems to have noticed, or has noticed and doesn't seem to care. So long as it stays 1-1, this isn't going anywhere. JazzMan 23:39, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

So, what you mean to say is, jokes about a woman's breasts are considered classy? I seem to remember two of those. Do the words Distracting Cleavage and Chain Bikini Chick sound familiar? PokeDM

Actually I never said anything of the sort. I will again remind you that Other Stuff Exists: stick to the merit of the article in question, not other articles. If you think something's wrong with those articles, then add a delete template to them. I haven't made an extensive review of every single item in April Fools, but the only relevant articles to my argument would be ones involving poop, and I haven't seen any. (And if they're there, I'll add a delete tag to them, too, so it's not an argument for the continued existence of this one).

Since you asked, though, I think that poop is a little lower on the classy scale than cleavage. Chain Bikini Chick is a long-standing inside joke within D&D and the fantasy genre in general, and Distracting Cleavage is an off-shoot of that. And it's not something that babies and monkeys do, and that would make people vomit if it happened in real life. Classy? Not really. Classier? definitely yes. JazzMan 15:55, 15 May 2010 (UTC)

Now, if you had a feat called "boob-flasher" and the content was "you can make an attack action to flash your boobs at an opponent; if they fail a save they are blinded for X amount of time", I would probably strongly consider adding a delete tag. JazzMan 15:55, 15 May 2010 (UTC)

Funny you should say that, in the AD&D monster manual nymphs gain an ability were if you see them naked you must make a save or die. This is also akin to the normal nymph ability blinding beauty. How about those deleting those? :P--Vrail 20:38, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

Funny You should say that... Those abilities arent in the SRD, so theres nothing to delete :P apparantly wotc owns the blinding beauty ability, so its not our problem --Name Violation 02:48, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

Though that ability isn't intended for humor and it's not meant to be "dirty". I can't really comment otherwise, not having seen the rule first-hand. JazzMan 03:13, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

Lol, trying to play devils advocate, guess it didn't work to well.:P Anyways, I've visited this page so many times I kinda feel obligated to say something on topic, so here goes:

I don't think this article has any merit to stay. It is pointless, can be considered rude/vulgar, and I do not find it at all funny. However personally I don't think we should have any joke articles (unless they're really well done, then they're great) and all April fools articles should be deleted after April 1st, or at least some time that week.

So, there ya go, incredibly I actually said something on topic (Don't worry, I won't do it again)! ;)--Vrail 03:23, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

I have to disagree about the april fools articles. What if someone wants to run a silly joke filled campaign? we support all other kinds of material, why not humorous? just because something is funny doesnt make it bad. hell there is a feat in sandstorm that makes hippos unable to attack you. WTF? I think thats stupid as hell, but thats in published material. The april fools category serves a purpose, and we shouldnt get rid of something because its different. its like any variant rule, some people might use it but most won't. --Name Violation 06:19, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

Lol, that part was a personal opinion based on what I use, I didn't mean it to sound like an attack. :)

Oh, and the thing about hippos, what are you talking about? Hippos not being able to attack you for some random unexplained reason? Makes perfect sense to me!:P--Vrail 06:28, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

suggestions

this feat has potential, especially for monkey-men raes. i think there are too many prereqs tho, drop precise shot. actual monkeys should be able to use this feat. also maybe make the blinded d4 rounds instead of 2, and add nausea, fort 10+con mod negates. and possible change the name poop to dung. i have to admit this feat does make me facepalm a bit, but we've had a monkey man in a group before with an item from MiC that lets you fling "poo" and it was funny as hell. while it may not be for everyone, there are a lot worse things on this wiki --Name Violation 17:38, 15 May 2010 (UTC)

there are a lot worse things on this wiki Such as? Having something worse doesn't mean we don't get rid of this, it means we get rid of those as well.

Speaking of balance, if we are going to keep this, I don't think blinding should be an aspect at all, since it means that every time you hit you automatically hit in the eyes, and that should be harder than normal, not easier. Nausea makes sense though. Additionally it's missing stats: does this count as a regular attack, or is throwing one piece a standard action? How much can you poop in one round? JazzMan 20:06, 15 May 2010 (UTC)

so what about removing all prereqs., or maybe making type prereqs (animal, monstrous humanoid, ect) make it range touch and causes nausea (and maybe a penalty to cha based skills and checks). make an improved version that nauseates everyone within 10 feet of the target. maybe another feat (with what this has for prereqs currently + "dung slinger") for the d4 rounds blinding in addition to nausea.. thoughts? --Name Violation 20:14, 15 May 2010 (UTC)

I basically figured the poop-toss would be a standard attack, such as replacing a swing with your sword with a thrown wad of dung. So, in the case of the monk, a flurry of blows effectively becomes a flurry of digested whatever-you-just-ate. As for the precise shot, that's how the eyes get factored in. I was thinking about nausea, but then I decided poop hitting someone in the face and blinding them would be funnier. The prerequisites stay, since, after all, it takes an accurate throw to hit with that (otherwise it just breaks up). Throw Anything, sure, we can get rid of, and just use a -4 penalty on the roll (poop does break up in flight). I think anyone should be able to use this, simply because it'd be funny to hear the DM say "suddenly, the orc takes a dump in his hand and catapults the fresh excrement directly towards your cleric." PokeDM

I just had a sad realization, though. I'm defending an article that literally is a load of crap. PokeDM

Heh, now that I find funny :) JazzMan 05:36, 16 May 2010 (UTC)

I know, right? I know this is juvenile. I know this is rather low-brow. I looked at the template for deletion rules, too. If there's anything that doesn't make this playable (be it lack of filling out, or something along those lines) I'd like to know. As far as the TFD's concerned, as long as it's playable, it's legit. Of course, this is really the admin's decision, not mine. Poop-slinging is rather disgusting. Would a mud-slinger be more acceptable? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by PokeDM (talk • contribs) . Please sign your posts.

Wait, I figured you were the one who created it in the first place, is that not true?

It seems playable to me... if you are into that sort of thing. It's not missing anything major as far as I know, but I'm still not sure if it's balanced. Is there any other blinding-type feat to compare it to?

As far as criteria for deletion goes, I was just told "Anything with a good reason to be deleted... should be deleted", which is about as vague as it gets. That's why I like to give things a full discussion before deleting them, if possible. I'd definitely have no problem with a mud-slinging feat, and such a feat would probably not even need to be in the April Fools category, either. JazzMan 02:23, 18 May 2010 (UTC)

Wait a sec. This uses only a slightly more gross version of the humor found on the Baby of Wonder item, also in the April Fool's section. It uses stinking cloud at random. Nobody needs a good imagination to guess HOW it uses that. I know other stuff exists, but if we're allowing the same humor as this, and that's not being deleted, why is MY feat being deleted? I understand issues of balance, but there's a feat to blind your opponents with your fists detailed in Oriental Adventures called Falling Star Strike. This feat actually has MORE prereqs than that, so this is actually under-balanced. How is any part of this not allowed? -- PokeDM

The key to "Baby of Wonder" is subtly using things from DnD canon to make jokes. This isn't so subtle, and it doesn't use DnD spells/effects/abilities to enhance the humor. This is vulgar, and not funny enough to overlook how vulgar it is. I know, this coming from the guy who spent the last 3 days editing non-stop on Hooker (3.5e Class), but trust me. --Badger 00:42, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

*Sigh* WP:OTHERCRAPEXISTS. I really don't think you are getting this. This is a wiki. The fact that Baby of Wonder exists and uses the same kind of humor does not mean that it and everything like it are approved. It simply means that nobody's marked it for deletion yet. Every other April Fools article is irrelevant to this discussion. Period. End of story. I have not seen Baby of Wonder, nor did I know of it's existence before you mentioned it, therefor it is not hypocritical of me to vote for deletion of this even though other articles like it are still around.

So far, I haven't seen any argument against deletion that isn't predicated on the existence of another article.

The balance issues are separate from the discussion for deletion. I'm not going to call for deletion of something that's unbalanced, and even if I were, I don't think this is so terribly unbalanced that it would warrant deletion.

And Badger's right. There's a difference between a joke about crap, and a joke that's just crap (double meaning intended). This is the latter; BoW is the former. Add to that that BoW is expertly subtle in it's use of scatological humor whereas Poop-Slinger, well, is about as subtle as a party clown at a funeral. If you really are so offended that nobody seems to want this feat around then why not try changing it to be more creative? Call it (throwing this out of the top of my head) "I shouldn't have eaten that road-side tuna taco" instead of Poop-slinger, for instance. Explain how the feat works in a humorous fashion instead of outright saying "you poop in your hand and throw it at people". Then it's no longer a crappy joke, but a subtle, funny joke that just happens to be about crap. JazzMan 01:30, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Truthfully, though

This actually insn't a new idea, albeit the other idea was even grodier than this, and it was actually deadly. The Viet Congs would smear human fecal matter on their punji traps, which would infect the blood with e-coli. This is the lesser of two evils, in my opinion. -- PokeDM

A more subtle variant

Ok, here's a quick re-write. While I'm not sure it's any better, it at least has a DnD joke and some flavor text (which is critical for April Fools items). At the end of the day, it's still a glorified poop joke:

Master of Goblin Cuisine

You've studied in the finest culinary schools the goblins have to offer, but your food still leaves something to be desired. While your food lacks in taste, health, and texture, it compensates by having certain otherwise tactical characteristics. Any time up to 5 hours after the last meal you made, you find yourself armed for battle.

Prerequisite: Throw Anything, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot

Benefit: While in combat you may take a full round action (or separately, a move and standard action) to ready and throw a "Goblin dung bomb" as a ranged touch attack. If the attack hits, your opponent is blinded for two rounds as they wipe the gunk from their eyes.

Special: A Monk with this feat treats all Goblin dung-bombs as Monk weapons. --Badger 01:56, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Okay, now THAT I see is way funnier. So, I just need to find a way to make this funnier than what it is, since this is just gross-out. I get it now. I want to steal this idea. Can I steal this idea? -- PokeDM

Lol, I like that one. The opening summary is really good, except perhaps the same subtle discretion could be used in the benefits and special, rather than saying 'dung bomb'... Anyways, just my opinion, this variant looks quite good. :)--Vrail 02:45, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

It's all yours. Glad I could help. As for the subtle "dung bomb" I don't know how to keep it subtle, while still getting the "poop" concept across... --Badger 02:48, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

How's this?

Master of Goblin Cuisine

You've studied in the finest culinary schools the goblins have to offer, but your food still leaves something to be desired. While your food lacks in taste, health, and texture, it compensates by having certain otherwise tactical characteristics. Any time up to 5 hours after the last meal you made, you find yourself armed for battle.

Prerequisite: Throw Anything, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot

Benefit: While in combat you may take a full round action (or separately, a move and standard action) to ready and throw a "Goblin cuisine" however this one is slightly more processed than when you ate it. This counts as a ranged touch attack. If the attack hits, your opponent is blinded for two rounds as they recover from the "Cuisine" in their eyes.

Special: A Monk with this feat treats all extra processed "Goblin Cuisines" as Monk weapons.

Does that work for you guys?--Vrail 03:04, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Suppose we replace "a Goblin cuisine however this one is slightly more processed than when you ate it" with "some of your last meal" or "ordure"? I like ordure, because although it means poop outright (not some sort of metaphor or euphemism), it's a word you don't see much. --Badger 03:35, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Hmm... I'm not sure I completely like those replacements I'm looking for something more subtle than those, but nice word though. :D Could you explain what you find wrong with the way I worded it so we could think of something else?--Vrail 03:40, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

It's just a little too wordy for my linking. Less is usually more, especially if working with satire and subtle humor. --Badger 03:45, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Good point... that would work better, however this was the only way I could do it well... I'll think about it a bit.--Vrail 03:47, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Hmmm, how about we replace poop with George Bush and leave it as is? :P Anyways, I think I have a good one, how about we replace 'a "Goblin cuisine" however this one is slightly more processed than when you ate it' with 'an e-coli orderve'?--Vrail 03:55, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Not to let my food-geek come out, but if the chef is choosing the appetizers it should be "Amuse-bouche", not "hors d'oeuvres". Also, Amuse-bouche is fun to say. --Badger 04:00, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Lol, nice. :P. Except e-coli hors d'oevres sounds better as a phrase than e-coli amuse-bouche, but it is an awesome word. :D Except as has been stated the goblin chefs aren't exactly the best... maybe they made hors d'oevres? :D--Vrail 04:31, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Well, the other Feat's up now, so I guess we should delete this one. Also, I don't even think Goblins make a not-already-digested meal. -- PokeDM