Talk:D&D Wiki Magazine/Issue 3

First Ideas

• I would suggest changing the name of the theme to Castles and Fortresses because based on the Castle Wikipedia link there is a difference between them, or call it Castles and Siege Weapons.
• Is tanks and other type of machines are considered siege weapons, and if so should we make them as magical items similar to the legendary mechanical scorpion in the Dungeon Master book.
• Maybe make a simplified method to creating castles similar to the 3.5e as a hombrew rule, and it should mention the castles and forts part and how much that you have to pay for them to be made.

Azernath (talk) 10:30, 21 September 2015 (MDT)

I'm thinking of extending the theme to "Castles and Heraldry". We can include heraldic beasts and anything to do with flags, pennants, jousting, noble lineage, etc.

As for castle creation for 5e, that might be okay if we have enough time, but there's already a good 3.5e book called Stronghold Builder's Guidebook that works just as well for 5e (it's full of castle rooms/sections that have a gold piece value and space requirement, what staff you need, etc), I think we would just repeat a lot of what is in there.

Think this would fit the theme Banner Ring (3.5e Equipment) --Calidore Chase (talk) 05:19, 27 September 2015 (MDT)

That's good, do the creation costs look about right to you? Marasmusine (talk) 09:53, 27 September 2015 (MDT)

If you want to add the heraldry part then that is great because that opens the possibility for more things to add like banners that each give a bonus to something or a kind of badges that have more use then the ones in the DM book, but I still have a question. What do you think about the tanks? An where should I put them? Items or Siege Weapons?

I know about the book because that is where I got the idea from, but coming think of it I don't think they had a part about to build siege weapon in both workshops and during sieges because that we can do.

P.S. Do you think that either the idea of Champion (5e Creature), Skeleton Knight (5e Creature), or Wight Tyrant (5e Creature) would fit the theme? Azernath (talk) 10:06, 22 September 2015 (MDT)

I don't know about the tanks, it's anachronistic so perhaps diverts too far from the theme. I'm not sure about the creatures either, sorry :/ Marasmusine (talk) 10:27, 22 September 2015 (MDT)

Personally, I think anachronism is D&D's hat, so to speak. Rapiers and greatswords, anyone? But yeah, as long as it is balanced to work alongside regular type DnD stuff, it should be fine. NOTE: I am rather biased, since at least three of my classes use gunpowder weapons.--Salasay Δ 22:21, 22 September 2015 (MDT)

I'm not saying that an anachronistic tank shouldn't be in D&D, I'm saying I don't want it in an issue about castles and heraldry. Let it be in a future issue :). Marasmusine (talk) 00:50, 23 September 2015 (MDT)

I think this would fit but it needs more interest: Manservant (4e Creature). I got the 5e books so now I can do 5e stuff as well! PrinceoftheAngels (talk)

Contributions

So I think it's time for us to start the pruning and reviewing process of what we've got so far. Not to say that new stuff cant be added, but we have a TON of candidate pages right now. I almost feel like the theme is a little too vague, but we can't really specify much without getting rid of some really cool stuff. I would like to say that the siege machines and stuff, while they fit the theme perfectly well, should probably be saved for a future Steel & Machines issue. Same could possibly be said about my Grenadier class. Trinkets seem to be coming along nicely, though, so i think we might could make 20 if we wanted to. --Salasay Δ 18:03, 30 September 2015 (MDT)

Just keep throwing stuff at me, then I can organize things into sections/sub-themes then decide what to keep. I will probably do this after Calidore Chase has had chance to upload his stuff.

I'll sow the seed now for some kind of editorial. Salasay and ConorOberstIsGo did a great job for issue 1 and 0. General "castle" articles have already been done to death in Dragon magazine and other places, so perhaps we need some kind of weird angle or particular aspect. What kind of fortified structures do unusual humanoids make? What cool castles have we seen in other fiction that can serve as inspiration? (in my mind's eye right now I can see the fortress of ultimate evil from Time Bandits) That sort of thing. Marasmusine (talk) 02:03, 1 October 2015 (MDT)

I'm (attempting to) picture R'lyeh right now...--Salasay Δ 22:52, 9 October 2015 (MDT)

Trinkets done! --PrinceoftheAngels (talk) 17:49, 1 October 2015 (MDT)

Editorial

I have an interesting idea. What if the Editorial was a narrative story of a siege or some other castle type action? If we still wanted a more serious editorial we could always include a narrative as another article. The castle theme just seems to lend itself to a narrative so well. --Salasay Δ 18:03, 30 September 2015 (MDT)

Oh, yes, I'll take anything, also see my comment above, which I wrote before seeing this. :)

Contributions and IP

I would like to remind everyone that I won't accept contributions to the magazine that are directly based on the IP of other games or fiction, thank-you! Marasmusine (talk) 17:23, 1 October 2015 (MDT)

Suggested Additions

Clothes, Livery (5e Equipment) for inclusion with the squire background. I would very much like to see the Squire and Knight backgrounds completed. They have been on the wiki for ages, and are clearly meant to be together.

Manpower (5e Variant Rule) brings up the subject of royalty and armies repeatedly. Not directly "castles and chivalry" though.

Cavalier Archetype, certainly chivalrous.

Creature Suggestion

Living Banners: Construct guardians that are hung in and about the castle, they are most typically pictured with animals. When their protection criteria are met, the animal on the banner comes to life and attacks intruders, assassins, etc. -- this is a general idea at this point, not sure if I can create the actual creature so if someone wants to take this project on. I envision CR 2-4, non-living, neutrally aligned generally.... --Calidore Chase (talk) 01:51, 23 October 2015 (MDT)

What about a magic object which summons the creature depicted on its face? That way, you don't need to build a bunch of creature variants. Because one would likely just copy the stats of a few predictable animals, (a lion, a unicorn, a dragon, etc.) you could instead apply an effect to the monster summoned. For example, it may read, "The creature being summoned must be neutraly aligned. The summoned creature is a construct." This makes infinite variety, allowing people to use anything the MM contains, as well as homebrew inventions. --Kydo (talk) 08:10, 23 October 2015 (MDT)

Rough Schedule

I'll be starting actual editing on the magazine tomorrow with the aim of publishing at the end of January. In terms of crediting authors, per my discussion with Green Dragon, I will include links to page histories with each entry. The exception is trinkets, since it is embedded in the magazine page (so I've just provided a byline for PrinceoftheAngels, Salasay and Calidore Chase - did I forget anyone?), and there'll be bylines for anyone who writes an editorial or essay. Do people still want to see an "author index" in addition to the history links? Marasmusine (talk) 03:02, 31 October 2015 (MDT)

Do we have a file set up yet? --Salasay Δ 07:07, 6 December 2015 (MST)

Attribution test

This is what pages will look like with bylines and links to page history.

http://1drv.ms/1Q7p0kw

What do people think of this formatting? Marasmusine (talk) 13:33, 5 November 2015 (MST)

I think that works just fine. Gets people to the wiki a little bit too. --Kydo (talk) 07:22, 6 November 2015 (MST)

Court Champion

Can someone familiar with 3.5e look through Court Champion (3.5e Prestige Class). I am keen on putting this in, are there any balance issues? Marasmusine (talk) 04:11, 16 November 2015 (MST)

Probably a conflict of interest, since I'm the author, but I'd say it's balanced, leaning towards underpowered if anything. Gonna run through some of the design decision just 'cause. It's AC bonus is a lot less than the Duelist (which can get up to +2 per level if fighting defensively and a high enough Int score), but it doesn't require any high atribute scores, and combat expertise is better than fighting defensively; the higher defense from the feat makes up for some of the Duelists advantages in Elaborate Parry. The court champion also retains the ability to wear armor and shields. This lack of static AC is made up for by Parry, along with getting a boost to saves as well, which is important against spellcasters. Riposte gives a pretty powerful offensive option, and it has several roleplaying/skill bonuses as well. Overall, probably a slight improvement on the Duelist, but with stricter alignment requirements. The cheesiest thing to do would be to use Robilar's Gambit combined with Expert Defense, allowing you to use combat expertise to make up for Robilars defense penalty, while Expert Defense removes combat expertise's attack penalty when making the return attacks with Robilars. There's probably better ways to cheese Robilar's Gambit, though. Frenzied Parry takes a penalty (and a failed parry is an automatic hit), and you can't just block the first two (and thus highest BAB) attacks, unless the first parry fails; this means an enemy with more than 1 attack will get at least one attack against your actual AC. The bonuses are all pretty non-specific, though, to make it so you could still "duel" a dragon or other beasty just as well as a human. Edit: the court champions main advantages over duelist are utility; the enemy takes penalties to attacks against the champions allies, is slow to retreat, and the champion can 'stick' to the target if it tries to five foot step away. Also, as of my latest edit I believe the class is fully complete. Zau (talk) 21:05, 17 November 2015 (MST)

Thanks, Zau. Marasmusine (talk) 01:23, 18 November 2015 (MST)

Discarded Items

Can I get a reason why the Shieldman (5e Archetype), Shieldman (5e Creature), and the Shieldman Captain (5e Creature) are discarded from this issue? I know the Defensive Reflex ability is a little overpowered, but I would appreciate it if someone can tell me what is the wrong with it? Azernath (talk) 02:32, 22 November 2015 (MST)

Nothing wrong with them. The connection with the theme isn't strong enough. They seem more to do with battlefields. Marasmusine (talk) 03:12, 22 November 2015 (MST)

So are they good and balanced? Azernath (talk) 10:53, 22 November 2015 (MST)

At Talk:Shieldman (5e Creature) I made a note that CR 1 would be better, I haven't looked at the others in detail. Marasmusine (talk) 11:06, 22 November 2015 (MST)

Sorry for the delay in updates

Here's where we're at: http://1drv.ms/1Q7p0kw

I want to get the gaps filled before adding new stuff, so there's some 5e mundane items and magic items to create, some 5e siege stuff, 3.5e traits. As usual I've ended up with a single-column gap for a 4e something.

Note that I haven't found the best way to add history links yet, the current plan is to add these to the index as the very last thing (after the last index update). Marasmusine (talk) 02:12, 7 December 2015 (MST)

...and now my computer is away for repair again. 3rd time this year. These setbacks probably mean we're looking at a February release instead of January. In the meantime, further contributions are welcome. Marasmusine (talk) 10:39, 24 December 2015 (MST)

NPCs

With regards the comments on NPCs and races, with the ones I am creating at least, they will have something unique related to their race, beyond what the racial traits give them (the runestamp for the dwarven armourer, for example) Another reason is, and I'm speaking as a DM who improvises almost the entire adventure, it's useful to have ready-statted racial NPCs to drop straight into the adventure on-the-fly. Marasmusine (talk) 12:35, 25 December 2015 (MST)

We could keep the elven and dwarven NPCs for their respectful issues. Azernath (talk) 16:19, 6 January 2016 (MST)

I'm trying to make some NPCs for castles! Marasmusine (talk) 02:31, 10 January 2016 (MST)

Steam Tank

Do you guys think that a steam tank fit the issue? And if so, should I make it a vehicle or a siege equipment? Azernath (talk) 16:51, 6 January 2016 (MST)

I think that's straying too far, but you could give it a go. It would be vehicle. You won't have much time to create it, I'm aiming for publishing this by the end of January. I would prefer time be spent creating more obvious castle stuff. Marasmusine (talk) 02:35, 10 January 2016 (MST)

Update

Just to let everyone know I've updated the work-in-progress. Awkward gaps are everywhere! Marasmusine (talk) 03:29, 13 January 2016 (MST)

I know, I know, it's February already. We had a computer away for repair for a total of... I dunno.. about 6 weeks... over the past 6 months, so my family had been using my "work" computer, so this has set me back 1 month and a bit. Now my daughter is getting into gaming and using my computer to play Lego Marvel and Goat Simulator! I can't win. I spent far to much time mulling over my "Quick Castles" (but that's done now). As always, if you think you can help, have a look at the preview, see where there are gaps. I just want to fill the gaps now so I can publish. It will also take me some time to add links to the author index. Marasmusine (talk) 13:56, 2 February 2016 (MST)

I really wanted to see the 5e Knight class completed for this, but I really disagree with the direction its creative source wants to maintain, and I've just lost interest in spending the effort to care enough to work on it. --Kydo (talk) 22:58, 3 February 2016 (MST)

Make a variant or make what you want and name it something else... use the word "knight" from a different language, like Ritter from German. --Calidore Chase (talk) 23:31, 3 February 2016 (MST)

I might be able to help fill out the gaps with few ideas:

1. Near the Trinket column, we might add another column that help the DM roleplaying as a king to grant a job or a title themed around castles to PCs as a reword. The column could be similar to the DMG encounters table, maybe even add player Charisma Modifier to the roll. The jobs could be vary from Servant, Squire and Guard to Knight, Lord or maybe even a Duke with a Land to hold.
2. Multible Archetypes can be made such as Archer, Knight or others.
3. NPCs Like Archers, Marksmen, Pikemen and maybe even a Grand Knight.

Azernath (talk) 11:29, 5 February 2016 (MST)

Thanks, let me lay out what needs filling:

• My editorial (lolwhut)
• Half page next to Trinket Box. Ideally I want this to be some kind of random table - I've been thinking that this section is for random things that can go with any edition. But any other kind of non-edition specific material can go here.
  • Alternately a guest editorial, but it doesn't look like anyone is interested.
• Half page for 5e Siege Equipment. I will probably adapt the flame cannon thing. Done, I felt that the flame cannon doesn't make a good siege weapon, so added the handgonne.
• Half a page for a 3.5e creature. I have scoured the creature lists here but I haven't found anything appropriate.

Half a page for 3.5e feats, traits or flaws.

I am currently on a 2 week break, so this is by best chance of finishing this thing. I aim to get it done by the end of next week. So I advise against getting into writing anything new. Marasmusine (talk) 12:53, 5 February 2016 (MST)

I've smooged the 3.5e feats/traits and the 3.5e creature sections together, so that's okay now.

I'm in the process of adding one of Cancelion's 3.5 quests.

So the main gaps now are editorials and/or something to go next to the trinkets.

I can see the light at the end of the tunnel! Marasmusine (talk) 10:53, 25 February 2016 (MST)

Editorial

I could try to write one concerning castles, my schedule is pretty tight right now though. Do we have a consensus on what we'd like the editorial to cover? --Calidore Chase (talk) 19:58, 25 February 2016 (MST)

• Page 4 is half filled, I could add a title or positions table that can help a DM to choose as a reward. The titles can be filled with extra discription that will add great flavor. Even if it doesn't get into the magazine, it would still be worth making.
• I think we agree that we are good with the equipment and siege weapons; however, we have on creature for 5e and it is mixed with equipment. I can create few creatures that can relate to the subject. Azernath (talk) 23:01, 25 February 2016 (MST)

Done

Okay, I can't look at this anymore, I've finished the index (with links to the wiki), tidied it up. I'm sorry I could not wait for further entries, and I did not get round to vetting the 3.5e magic items. Still, it's 29 pages, which is the biggest issue yet. I will upload it to drivethruRPG tonight, I invite you to look through the WIP link, let me know if you see anything amiss. Marasmusine (talk) 11:13, 3 March 2016 (MST)

It looks great, nice arrangement of the sections with the no empty areas; however, my only problem/regret is that I couldn't add more things, and that a large part of the things that I added were not that 100% fitting to the issue, yet this only mean that I will have to try even harder (Mr. Optimistic speaking right here). Azernath (talk) 11:30, 3 March 2016 (MST)

I'm sorry I couldn't include more of your things, part of it was that I couldn't devote the time to checking all the newly-created stuff over, I even had to drop my own 5e NPCs! Marasmusine (talk) 13:15, 3 March 2016 (MST)

Hmm, no-one has downloaded it yet. I guess, everyone spread the word? Marasmusine (talk) 02:08, 6 March 2016 (MST)

I have a question on Talk:Portrait (5e Equipment) if you do not mind. --Green Dragon (talk) 08:06, 26 March 2016 (MDT)

Featured Article Review

Like the other magazine pages, this page does not meet FA standards. --Kydo (talk) 07:32, 11 September 2016 (MDT)

• Support — For the stated reason above. --Kydo (talk) 11:38, 18 September 2016 (MDT)

• Oppose — I think that being an FA brings attention to the hard work in the magazine, and since each article is reviewed as part of the magazine process the entire publication merits the FA status. I also feel that it is a good way to bring FA attention to smaller pages like equipment items, etc through their themes. For me, the compilation of the magazine together with a theme goes beyond the states required for FA comprehensive pages (minimum three paragraphs, and mechanics, etc). --Green Dragon (talk) 06:51, 2 October 2016 (MDT)