Talk:Tome of Necromancy (3.5e Sourcebook)/New Rules

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in the list of undead and how to crate them I couldn't help but notice that it didn't include the caller in the darkness from the expanded psionics handbook and all the undead from the book of vile darkness. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Zazmul (talkcontribs) . Please sign your posts.

Hello Zazmul. This actually isn't made by Wizards of the Coast, so I can't really answer as to why the original creator chose not to include certain items (such as the ones you mention above).   Hooper   talk    contribs    email   12:27, 10 October 2009 (MDT)

The Redefined Undead Type[edit]

Okay, so I'm not sure anyone's actually going to read this, but it was bugging me so I'll put it here, and at least I can use it for future reference. So, the author says that people are more willing to add subtypes to remove qualities listed under the base types than they are to just redefine the base type and add subtypes. That's weird. In fairness, the author seems as confused by it as I am, but he still goes on to contribute to that chain of thought. And it really bugs me. Especially since Undead have quote a few traits, and even though a lot of them aren't rational, it still means you're going to have to go through a long list of traits only to have to say, "Unless they have one or more of these subtypes," and the majority of undead do. So, below I will define what the Undead Type will mean, by default with no other explanation needed, and then I'll list the traits that would have been removed by Dark Minded and Unliving.

By definition, Undead:

That's all copy-pasted from this wiki's article on the SRD:Undead Type. Really does seem like there's a lot of stuff that Unliving creatures should not be immune to - and this also reveals that the author is wrong when he goes on about Ghouls and their lack of CON score. But whatever.

So, "Dark Minded" is assumed to be the default for undead. So far as I know, there aren't a whole lot of mindless undead - indeed, if you stick to the Monster Manual, I think it's just zombies and skeletons. Yet for some reason, in base D&D, all undead have all the traits for Mindless creatures, which are as follows: "A creature with no Intelligence score is mindless, an automaton operating on simple instincts or programmed instructions. It has immunity to mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects) and automatically fails Intelligence checks." So, Mindless undead get those traits, plus the bizarre "cannot heal damage on their own except through fast healing" addition. Also, for some reason, the author had it so that Undead with the Unliving subtype were vulnerable to sleep effects, even if they had no INT score, even though living creatures with no INT score aren't vulnerable to sleep effects. Unfortunately, it's years too late to argue with that, so I'll simply point it out and let people work out its rationality for themselves. Thus, Mindless Undead:

  • Have no INT score.
  • Is immune to mind-affecting effects, except for sleep effects if they have a CON score.
  • Automatically fails Intelligence checks.
  • Cannot heal damage on its own, though it can be healed by spells or through the Fast Healing ability.
  • Immune to damage to its mental ability scores.
  • Do not advance in age categories.

Unliving is a little less common, so I can see the case for making it a subtype. But, D&D defines things by how different they are from humans, so that is the route I will take. Thus, the "Dead" subtype can be added to any Undead, with the following results:

  • Have no Constitution Score.
  • Immune to nonlethal damage.
  • Do not eat, breathe, or sleep.

Simple, right? Dusk Raven (talk) 19:24, 25 November 2015 (MST)

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