Talk:Sand Balls (3.5e Spell)

Like Magic Missiles?

Would it be too much to ask if this became like the sand equivalent to Magic Missile and up the dmg to d4? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Soulfire91 (talk • contribs) 05:48, 13 June 2011 (MDT). Please sign your posts.

Yes as a matter of fact. I know it sounds stupid but if you compare the two this technique actually fires more projectiles than magic missile at lower levels. The 1 less damage makes up for that along with the ability to be dodged. (which I clarified in it) Of course, it could be argued that the ability to be dodged is enough of a nerf for the damage. I'll make a more in-depth comparison below.

Level	Magic Missile	Sand Balls	Higher Damage Cap
1	1 missile - 1d4 dam	2 balls - 2d3 dam	Sand Balls - 2
2	1 missile - 1d4 dam	3 balls - 3d3 dam	Sand Balls - 5
3	2 missiles - 2d4 dam	3 balls - 3d3 dam	Sand Balls - 1
4	2 missiles - 2d4 dam	4 balls - 4d3 dam	Sand Balls - 4
5	3 missiles - 3d4 dam	4 balls - 4d3 dam	Tie
6	3 missiles - 3d4 dam	5 balls - 5d3 dam	Sand Balls - 3
7	4 missiles - 4d4 dam	5 balls - 5d3 dam	Magic Missile - 1
8	4 missiles - 4d4 dam	5 balls - 5d3 dam	Magic Missile - 1
9	5 missiles - 5d4 dam	5 balls - 5d3 dam	Magic Missile - 5

So really, magic missile caps out at more, unavoidable damage but takes slower than sand balls. Also, on average, sand balls has a higher damage cap until level 7 by (again average) 3ish. Assuming 1 ball gets dodged every cast that's 3 cap damage out of the equation making each of these a very similar spell but sand balls a riskier one for more or less damage. Though in conclusion I would state sand balls still might need a higher damage dice because of the ability to be dodged. What do you think taking this into account? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Uhnaneemoos (talk • contribs) 04:00, 27 June 2011 (MDT). Please sign your posts.

I think that because of the ability to be dodged, the extra 1 point of dmg would not cause this ability to become OP and is reasonable. --Soulfire91 15:51, 10 July 2011 (MDT)

I have had a player using the Sandbender in the campaign I am currently running. I would like to also point out three other facts; First Thing: Magic Missiles does not miss, EVER. Meanwhile Sand Balls not only need to Hit the Target with a ranged touch attack but they then have a chance to dodge it with a reflex save. With the low base attack bonus that they have it almost never hit and when it does, they then seem to dodge it. If it weren't for the Sand Spikes he would be pretty useless at low levels. Second Thing: Magic missiles does Force damage that almost nothing can resist. And with Sand Balls dealing physical damage makes it harder when fighting creatures with damage reduction. Third Thing: Finally, Magic Missiles is a medium range spell. Sand Balls is only a close range spell, meaning if a Wizard and a Sandbender got into a fight, the wizard would kill the sandbender before he could get close enough to even cast his sand balls. Just a few thing that should be taken into consideration. --Korminor (talk) 17:46, 26 August 2013 (MDT)

Suggested new format

Sand Balls

Technique
Level:	Sandbender 1
Components:	S, M
Casting time:	1 round
Range:	Close (25 feet + 5 feet per 2 technician levels)
Targets:	1-7 Targets
Duration:	Instantaneous
Saving Throw:	Reflex
Spell Resistance:	No

Technique Points Required: 1

You form a cubic foot of attuned sand into 2 balls of compressed sand and fire them at your target(s), dealing 1d4 points of damage.

The Sand Balls strikes unerringly, even if the target is in melee combat or has less than total cover or total concealment, however they can be dodged with a successful Reflex Save. The Reflex Save negates the damage from 1 ball only, so a Reflex Save must be made for each ball. Specific parts of a creature can’t be singled out. Inanimate objects are can damaged by the spell.

For every two technician levels levels, you gain an additional Sand Ball for 3 at level 2, 4 at level 4, 5 at level 6, 6 at level 8, and the maximum of 7 sand balls at level 10 or higher. If you shoot multiple sand balls, you can have them strike a single creature or several creatures. A single sand ball can strike only one creature. You must designate targets before you check for reflex save or roll damage.

Material Component: 1 cubic foot of Attuned Sand

--Korminor (talk) 09:23, 27 August 2013 (MDT)