Talk:Earthfeeler (5e Subclass)

Just as a quick glance, this class needs a bit of a rework regarding the following, excluding the features themselves:

• this class is a fullcaster with a 1d10 hit die. Usually fullcasters get only 1d6.
• This class is a spellcaster but there is no mention of its spellcasting ability modifiers, saves, etc.
• Usually, when you gain a new spell level, you don't get new features, hence why fullcaster tables have a lot of spaces.

Interesting earth bender class idea.--Yanied (talk) 21:24, 25 September 2019 (MDT)

First of all, the new features coinciding with spell levels is a coincidence. Second, I am not changing the hit dice, they are fine the way they are. Ya know what? I'll lower it to a d8. And third, I fixed the spell save and spell attack bonus. Love to you, Yanied! <3 Flamestarter (talk) 17:27, 29 September 2019 (MDT)Flamestarter

Left off responding here for a bit, whoops.

• A d8 makes it comparable to a warlock, and those are only pseudo full-casters. If you're not willing to go any further then <shrug> well, I'm just advising you of the standard. (K, thanks.)
• It's not exactly a defense to call a feature a "coincidence" and leave it there. So, looking at other spellcasting classes from first party content, you can see that classes like wizard are super limited in hit dice and features because spells are just that powerful to compensate for it. Minor features like Extra Attack from the paladin can overlap with new spell levels because they have relatively little impact. Compared to something like your stone summon feature, which gives a player a CR5 creature to control, stone summon is very very impactful. So the rate at which this class gains new features should be changed to better adhere to that. Since a lot of the features revolve around a single theme, it is feasible to take a bunch of them and compress them into one feature that allows you to use them as an option, like the sorceror's font. (Not my fault. It's just a coincidence. If you want to reorder the abilities, go right ahead.)
• Why are the ASIs (4th level starting) at the bottom of the feature list? (I don't know.)
• The spellcasting ability and stuff has been added, which is good. So does this class require a focus or anything? Or spell preparation? You can refer to how classes like the Mage (5e Class), Death Dealer (5e Class) or any of the first party spellcaster classes (Wizard, Sorceror, etc) word their spellcasting feature, because there is more information to include. (Can you help?)
• On the feature of Stone Summon, keep in mind the highest CR a cleric can even destroy at the endgame of level 20 is CR4. (K!)
• What damage type does stone strike deal? (Fixed it)
• Granite Armor's duration should adhere to the standard timing, as 3 rounds is not one of them. They increase as 1 turn (until the end of your next turn), 1 minute, 10 minutes, 1 hour, etc. That huge increase of AC is also much stronger than any of the 3rd level abjuration spells (which is what is comparable at that level) (Kk!)
• Stone shape is an odd feature to give to a spellcaster when it can just be added to the spell list (and then you won't have an overlapping feature there!) (But I don't want it to be a spell, it's designed to be only for earthfeelers.)
• Your earthquake feature is like the spell earth tremor. I think it can just be added to the spell list so you only have spellcasting for your first feature, especially since you can use spell slots to augment it. The feature is also much stronger than the spell because you don't specify a save necessary for the damage, so it automatically hits. (Thank you!)
• I was wondering why blobby didn't recommend the earthquake spell to put on your list. Some of the spells compound to make the class more powerful, like all the healing ones (If you could put that down, that'd be great!)

Other than that, just add in some of the missing flavor, mechanical wording and information. And, just a heads up but, GD usually prefers subclasses to a class or they're stubbed. (Flavor was never my forte. Can you help with that?) --Yanied (talk) 12:57, 18 November 2019 (MST)

(Flamestarter (talk) 17:05, 19 November 2019 (MST)Flamestarter)

But the stone shape is worded super oddly as well. "You are able to cast the spell stone shape once per long rest as if it were a spell" ... so it is a spell.--Yanied (talk) 20:05, 19 November 2019 (MST)

Well, anyway, I made some small changes to add to the features. Spellcasting generally is wisdom, charisma, or intelligence. If you REALLY want strength-based spellcasting, then you can change that. Otherwise, the saving throws for the class can instead be wisdom and strength maybe. I did not touch the other features because as there are so many, to order them according to standard would be to stuff several of them into one feature to avoid being overpowered, and I didn't want to overstep there.

The spell list could use some trimming. I added earthquake but a lot of the spells make no sense to me in terms of an earth-based warrior (like why acid and fire spells in there? And healing?). Cutting down on the spells would also help with the balance aspect of the class and its other features.--Yanied (talk) 20:30, 19 November 2019 (MST)

Ok, first, strength was my intention. I wanted it to be... unique. I agree about the spell list, and I will change it soon. But not the healing magic. Earthen magic is known, among other things, for healing abilities. The Stone Shape ability is meant to have the spell stone shape that would not count against your spell total. Loves! Flamestarter (talk) 20:11, 20 November 2019 (MST)Flamestarter

(New person to jump in) So, (unless i got the wrong page or something) I don't understand the part where your spellcasting ability is wisdom, but you use strength for attacks and saves. Makes no sense to me, but idk.

Also, most all the abilties afte ASI's seem like weaker versions of certain spells. Fine idea, but doesn't feel all the special.

Would reccomend you tailor a unique spell list, not just give druid spells plus a few extras. Typically, the only ones who poach spell lists are thirdcasters, and those sre almost always subclasses. For half and full casters, the spell list is a sognificant part of role and identity. Plus they usualy get class unique spells. So by giving them the druid's lits, the class is basically a more agressive druid.

And for the healing: True e aww eth magic tends to seem connotate towards healing magic, but so is nature and divine. In 5e, divine rules the field of healing, with nature picking up a few tricks. Sure earth could count as nature, but this class seems to be more about stone, which has minimal life value. That plus this seems to be a more offensive oriented class, i would leave healing to others. (Forgive me if i missed something)

And, finally, no subclasses.

What subclasses would you have for a class based on earth? On the spells issue, that is to make more... balanced. It's not meant to be purely offensive, kind of an all around type thing, where the user can be anything they want to be the group orientation. The "poaching" is actually a lot easier since there are not a lot of earth-based spells to add to the spell list, and the druid list is actually very nature-oriented, so that's the reason for that. My abilities after the ASIs weren't supposed to be weaker spells, but ways to control the earth. Thank you for your input, unnamed person, but those comments have been handled beforehand. --Flamestarter (talk) 17:40, 6 February 2020 (MST)