Talk:Champion of the Ferine (3.5e Class)

Please update the Developer Log whenever you introduce a new change.

Place the date and time as displayed below whenever a new update is added, then the bullets containing the update for easy referencing.

Not Yet Implemented features are listed as (NYI); these are likely upcoming changes, namely mechanical and class altering.

NEW

>DATE<

>TIME<

EDIT(S) MADE

7/21/13

1:37PM

Version 2.0.0 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Added substantial amounts of clarification throughout the document.
Corrected Manifestation of the Feral Soul's claws - they come in pairs now, as intended originally.
Increased the effectiveness of Animal Metabolism at 9th level.
Altered the function of Unsettling Presence at 13th level - it now uses the following DC: Will save of DC 10 + 1/2 the Champion of the Ferine's level + the Champion of the Ferine's Strength modifier. In order for a creature to be immune to its effects.
At Epic Level 23, Sanguine Inheritance has changed. A Champion of the Ferine may now, three times per day, remove Exhaustion or Fatigue from herself, and heal three times the normal amount provided by Animal Metabolism.

- AF

6/24/13

3:12PM

Version 1.5.0 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Reorganized the Feral Soul class feature.
Champions of the Ferine at the 5th level now gain the Shapechanger Subtype.

- AF

6/16/13

3:30PM

Version 1.4.4 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Reorganized the Alternate Class Features and Expanded Class Features sections.

- AF

5/22/13

1:45AM

Version 1.4.3 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Pounce has been moved to 2nd level to remain more in line with competing base classes and their Alternate Class Features.
Trackless Step has been moved to 5th level due to it swapping locations with Pounce.

- AF

4/16/13

7:40AM

Version 1.4.2 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Alternate Form's Damage Reduction 20/Cold Iron has been reduced to Damage Reduction 15/Cold Iron, as has Ascendance's.

- AF

4/14/13

4:02PM

Version 1.4.1 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Unshackled Movement has been moved to the 3rd level to deter single level Champion of the Ferine multiclassing.
Evasive Instinct has been removed, as it no longer provides the synergy originally designed for the Champion of the Ferine.
Pounce has been moved to the 5th level, up from 1st, in order to deter single level Champion of the Ferine multiclassing.

- AF

4/12/13

7:15PM

Version 1.4.0 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Feral Soul now only grants +1 Natural Armor per adjustment.
Feral Soul no longer grants +1 to all Saves.
Invocation's Alternate Form now only grants +3 bonus AC as Dodge, down from +7.
Blade of the Wild is now a Supernatural Effect.
Empowerment: Primal Will no longer increases movement speed or grants snare immunity; it only grants immunity to effects which slow or reduce maximum movement speed.
Natural Immunity's effect is now clarified.
Unbound Agility now removes the Armor Check Penalty, no longer the Maximum Dexterity Bonus.
Empowerment: Vengeful Return now deals 1/2 Strength modifier damage instead of 1/2 regular melee damage.
Wrath of the Wild is now a Supernatural Effect.
Shattering Roar, Terrifying Roar and Deafening Roar now deal damage equal to the Champion of the Ferine's regular melee damage + Wisdom modifier as Sonic.
Shattering Roar, Terrifying Roar and Deafening Roar all have base DCs of 20.
Kindred Spirits is now a Supernatural effect.
Empowerment: Reckless Onslaught now deals damage to all targets within 5ft of the primary target.
Deafening Roar now attacks Fortitude instead of Will.
Ascendance now has the same reductions Invocation has.
NYI New Champion of the Ferine Spells: Jagged Tooth (SS), Embrace the Wild (SS), Low-Light Vision (SS), Scent (SS), Lion's Charge (SS).

- AF

4/10/13

2:39AM

Version 1.3.0 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Feral Soul has had its claw damage reduced, and begins with 1d4 claw damage, ending at 2d6 claw damage.
Feral Soul at 1st and 5th level no longer grants +1 to all Saves, and now only grants +1 Natural Armor.
Unshackled Movement no longer removes the Maximum Dexterity Bonus of heavy armor.
Unbound Agility has been added at 9th level and grants the Champion of the Ferine no limit on their Maximum Dexterity Bonus, even while wearing heavy armor unless they are carrying a heavy load.
Ex-Champions of the Ferine section has been expanded. Champions of the Ferine who fall from grace must return to a proper alignment, have an Atonement spell cast for them and complete a quest or geas to reconnect themselves with the animal soul which they draw upon.
Ex-Champions of the Ferine section now includes a statement that prevents taking further class levels of Champion of the Ferine should they take another class level that does not stack with their Champion of the Ferine class levels.
NYI New Champion of the Ferine Spells: Jagged Tooth (SS), Embrace the Wild (SS), Low-Light Vision (SS), Scent (SS), Lion's Charge (SS).

- AF

4/1/13

3:33AM

Version 1.2.7 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Enrage has been added as a new Alternate Class Feature. Enrage replaces Evasive Instinct, causing the Champion of the Ferine to become furious when struck by an invisible attacker, sneak attack, or are critically struck while denied their Dexterity bonus. Enrage immediately grants +10 movement speed and removes any effect which reduces the Champion of the Ferine's movement speed and or immobilizes them; however the Champion is not immune to these effects while Enrage is active. Enrage lasts for 3 rounds, fading at the end of the Champion of the Ferine's 3rd round, and cannot be triggered again for 3 rounds after that time. Enrage is treated as if the Champion of the Ferine was under the effects of a Rage spell, but may stack with other forms of Rage.
NYI New Champion of the Ferine Spells: Jagged Tooth (SS), Embrace the Wild (SS), Low-Light Vision (SS), Scent (SS), Lion's Charge (SS).

- AF

3/31/13

2:32AM

Version 1.2.6 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Empowerment: Primal Will has been added at 7th level, which allows a Champion of the Ferine the following bonuses while active; For the duration of Empowerment: Primal Will, a Champion of the Ferine's movement speed cannot drop below her base movement speed, and any effect which would deny or impede movement does not effect her. In addition, her movement speed is increased by +15 feet for the duration of this effect.
Empowerment: Maiming Wounds now mentions in its description; "This increase to threat range and confirmation of critical hits does not stack with any source except for Scent of Blood."
Shattering Roar now mentions that it still triggers its effects even if the spell was interrupted previously.
Wrath of the Wild now specifies that the 1/2 bonus damage it deals while Empowerment: Untamed Power is active, is rounded up.
Inscribed Greatswords now gain the Returning property as part of the added class features.
NYI New Champion of the Ferine Spells: Jagged Tooth (SS), Embrace the Wild (SS), Low-Light Vision (SS), Scent (SS), Lion's Charge (SS).

- AF

3/21/13

12:11AM

Natural Immunity has been expanded in terms of capability; any effect which would be terminated by a successful Neutralize Poison or Remove Disease spell automatically succeeds in removal if it was to effect the Champion of the Ferine, granting them further immunity to effects which are not specifically diseases or poison but are like them, such as parasites.
NYI New Champion of the Ferine Spells: Jagged Tooth (SS), Embrace the Wild (SS), Low-Light Vision (SS), Scent (SS), Lion's Charge (SS).

- AF

3/21/13

8:16PM

Many sections of the Class Features text have been clarified.
Empowerment: Untamed Power now also lowers the AC of its victims by -2 until the end of the Champion of the Ferine's next turn.

- AF

3/18/13

4:48AM

Version 1.2.5 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Feral Soul now also prevents the containment, control, corruption or destruction of the Champion of the Ferine's soul, even if it goes against the Champion of the Ferine's desires.
Ferocious Assault now specifies that one cannot interchangeably strike with different natural, carried, or equipped weapons; only one "armed" attack type can be carried out at any one time.

- AF

2/24/13

7:40PM

Version 1.2.4 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Minor edits to formatting were made for smoother reading.
Natural Immunity is now correctly immune to all forms of suppression, and functions no matter the Champion of the Ferine's awareness of it.
Andarra Bloodmane, a level 17 NPC, is now listed, along with a possible encounter involving her, in the "Champions of the Ferine in the Game" section.
Correct formatting errors in the Alternate Class Features section.
Champions of the Ferine in the Game section completed.
NYI Ferocious Assault now specifies that one cannot interchangeably strike with different natural, carried, or equipped weapons; only one "armed" attack type can be carried out at any one time.

- AF

2/21/13

2:47AM

Version 1.2.3 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Alternate Form and Ascendance now grant +20 Damage Reduction/Cold Iron, up from +10 Damage Reduction/Cold Iron.
Alternate Form and Ascendance now grant 10 more feet of movement speed.
Increased the DC Knowledge: Nature for other players to learn about Champions of the Ferine.
Alternate Class Feature: Beastly Endurance: You no longer gain Natural Armor through the progression of Feral Soul, instead gaining +3 Damage Reduction/Cold Iron each time you would have benefited from an increase in Natural Armor because of Feral Soul. This damage reduction is additive with all other alike damage reduction gained through Feral Soul and Invocation.
Alternate Class Feature: Spell Barrier: You no longer gain Resistance to fire/cold/acid/lightning damage through Feral Soul, Alternate Form and Invocation, and instead benefit from Spell Resistance of the same value increase that you would have received from those sources to Resistance. This Spell Resistance is treated as Resistance for the purposes of advancement through class features, and as such, does not stack with sources other than Feral Soul, Alternate Form and Invocation.
Alternate Class Feature: Inscription: A Champion of the Ferine may inscribe their greatsword, increasing its Hit Points and Hardness by 1.5x and making it into a Masterwork weapon if it was not already.
Alternate Class Feature: Wolf Champion has been added. Your physical qualities are more canine instead of feline, and your Alternate Form takes on a wolf-shape now.
Alternate Class Feature: Bear Champion has been added. Your physical qualities are more ursine instead of feline, and your Alternate Form takes on a bear-shape now.
NYI Correct formatting errors in the Alternate Class Features section.
NYI Champions of the Ferine in the Game section completed.

- AF

2/19/13

6:53PM

Version 1.2.1 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Alternate Form and Ascendance now grant +15 Damage Reduction/Cold Iron, up from +10 Damage Reduction/Cold Iron.
NYI Alternate Form and Ascendance now grant 10 more feet of movement speed.
NYI Alternate Class Feature: Beastly Endurance: You no longer gain Natural Armor through the progression of Feral Soul, instead gaining +3 Damage Reduction/Cold Iron each time you would have benefited from an increase in Natural Armor because of Feral Soul. This damage reduction is additive with all other alike damage reduction gained through Feral Soul and Invocation.
NYI Alternate Class Feature: Trappings of the Wolf: Your feline-esque traits gained through Feral Soul appear canine, wolfish instead, and your Alternate Form takes on the shape of a large wolf in bipedal form and lacking a tail. When assuming this Alternate Form for the first time, you may choose the appearance of the Alternate Form, such as natural coloration and markings, of which must be possible and credible for that species you have selected; once the decision has been made, the Alternate Form will remain this way indefinitely and express the chosen appearance every time it is assumed.
NYI Alternate Class Feature: Trappings of the Bear: Your feline-esque traits gained through Feral Soul appear ursine, bear-like instead, and your Alternate Form takes on the shape of a mighty bear in bipedal form. When assuming this Alternate Form for the first time, you may choose the appearance of the Alternate Form, such as natural coloration and markings, of which must be possible and credible for that species you have selected; once the decision has been made, the Alternate Form will remain this way indefinitely and express the chosen appearance every time it is assumed.

- AF

2/18/13

3:30PM

The Champion of the Ferine once again has Greater Spell Immunity after it was accidentally and unintentionally removed.

- AF

2/18/13

3:40AM

Version 1.2.0 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Corrected an error in the sentence referring to the True Seeing spell.
Starting gold for a Champion of the Ferine has been appropriately increased to 6d4x10 (the value assigned to Fighters) to better allow the class access to goods it should be capable of purchasing.
Champions of the Ferine now receive a unique and inscribed greatsword free of cost at 1st level (under the "Champions of the Ferine in the World" section).
Evasive Instinct clarifies that if the individual already had Uncanny Dodge prior to becoming a Champion of the Ferine they now receive Improved Uncanny Dodge to replace it.
Blade of the Wild now notes what happens if the individual had taken Combat Reflexes prior to becoming a Champion of the Ferine and reaching 4th level, and returns their feat in doing so.
Champions of the Ferine now have the Jump skill as part of their class skills.
Champions of the Ferine no longer have any form of Spell Resistance; this mechanic was interfering with the Champion of the Ferine from receiving beneficial effects.
Champions of the Ferine now gain +1 Fortitude, Reflex and Will each time they increase their Feral Soul through levels gained in Champion of the Ferine.
Champions of the Ferine now gain +5 fire, cold, acid, and lightning Resistance each time they increase their Feral Soul through levels gained in Champion of the Ferine.
Empowerment: Savage Strikes no longer infers it doubles the weapon's reach (range), but increases its critical threat range as normal. In addition, it is now a +4 to confirm a critical hit while active versus +5. Along with this, a Champion of the Ferine, while benefiting from Empowerment: Savage Strikes no longer receives any bonuses to confirm critical hits except from those gained via Scent of Blood.
All Roars now mention explicitly that they are a burst effect radiating from the Champion of the Ferine.

- AF

2/17/13

3:59PM

Version 1.1.6 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Additional inconsistencies regarding gender, plurality, and overall grammar have been corrected.
Minor explanation and lore anchoring for certain functions has been added.

- AF

2/16/13

9:07PM

Version 1.1.5 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Many of the inconsistencies regarding gender and plurality have been corrected.
Feral Soul now grants immunity to becoming raised as an Undead creature, and is gained at level 1.

- AF

2/16/13

5:45PM

NYI Version 1.1.5 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
NYI Feral Soul now grants immunity to becoming raised as an Undead creature, and is gained at level 1.

- AF

2/15/13

11:45PM

Version 1.1.0 of the Champion of the Ferine has been released.
Timeless Body, owing to the Champion of the Ferine's Druidic heritage, is gained at level 10.

- AF

2/13/13

5:47PM

Release Version 1.0.0 of the Champion of the Ferine is now available to D&D 3.5e Players.

- AF

2/13/13

4:16PM

Removed unnecessary formatting sections.
NYI Added spells available to the Champion of the Ferine class.
NYI RESERVE Notable Spells: Dispell Magic, Curse of Lycanthropy, Fly, Restoration, Bestow Curse, Charm Animal, Calm Animal, Endure Elements, Speak with Animals, True Strike, Restoration/Lesser, Detect Poison, Delay Poison, Detect Disease, Delay Disease, Death Knell, Gentle Repose, Hold Animal, Remove Disease, Remove Curse, Dominate Animal, Awaken (Animal), Animal Growth, Commune with Nature, Dispell Magic/Greater, Anti-Magic Field, Spell Turning, Symbol of Lycanthropy,.

- AF

2/10/13

9:10AM

Feral Soul now has correct references to the character and not the player (third person format established).
Unshackled Movement now removes the penalties to Dexterity for armor via Maximum Dex Bonus.
Blade of the Wild now mentions that it acts as Combat Reflexes in lieu of the feat itself.
The functions of all Roar abilities have been slightly clarified.
NYI Added spells available to the Champion of the Ferine class.
NYI RESERVE Notable Spells: Dispell Magic, Curse of Lycanthropy, Fly, Restoration, Bestow Curse, Charm Animal, Calm Animal, Endure Elements, Speak with Animals, True Strike, Restoration/Lesser, Detect Poison, Delay Poison, Detect Disease, Delay Disease, Death Knell, Gentle Repose, Hold Animal, Remove Disease, Remove Curse, Dominate Animal, Awaken (Animal), Animal Growth, Commune with Nature, Dispell Magic/Greater, Anti-Magic Field, Spell Turning, Symbol of Lycanthropy,.

- AF

2/09/13

3:52PM

Feral Soul now correctly states that the Natural Armor it grants stacks with worn armor in addition to itself.
Feral Soul's granted claw attack now correctly mentions that it can be upgraded via the Improved Natural Attack feat.
Feral Soul now clarifies that the stacking Spell Resistance does not stack with sources other than itself and Invocation.
The DC to cross an Anti-Magic Field while in Alternate Form has been reduced from 25 to 20.
NYI Feral Soul now has correct references to the character and not the player (third person format established).

- AF

2/09/13

7:07AM

NYI Feral Soul now correctly states that the Natural Armor it grants stacks with worn armor in addition to itself.
NYI Feral Soul's granted claw attack now correctly mentions that it can be upgraded via the Improved Natural Attack feat.
NYI Feral Soul now clarifies that the stacking Spell Resistance does not stack with sources other than itself and Invocation.

- AF

2/04/13

3:40AM

Feral Soul at 5th level now provides a passive +2 permanent increase to Will.
Feral Soul at 9th level now provides a passive +2 permanent increase to Will.
Empowerment: Wild Nullification has been added at level 21 (Epic Tier). All hostile spells or spell-like effects, including psi abilities and psi-like abilities, have a 25% chance to be reflected back to their caster. Targets critically struck by you while Wild Nullification is active are Dazed until the start of your next turn.
Scent of Blood has been added at level 21 (Epic Tier). If any attack in a Ferocious Assault critically strikes, your next attack gains a +5 attack roll bonus, and a +10 critical hit confirmation bonus if it also critically strikes.
Sanguine Inheritance has been added at level 23 (Epic Tier). Your Strength, Dexterity, Constitution and Wisdom ability scores improve by +2, and your Animal Metabolism is doubled in effectiveness, now functioning as follows; the amount of health regained per turn is 2 hit points per every 4 levels of Champion of the Ferine; the minimal amount regenerated by Animal Metabolism is 2 hit points per turn, with the maximum being 10 per turn. This effect occurs even while the Champion is unconscious or otherwise unable to act, and is not effected by affects which prevent healing.
Greater Blade of the Wild has been added at level 25 (Epic Tier). Your Blade of the Wild now also deals your Constitution modifier in bonus damage.
Overwhelming Presence has been added at level 27 (Epic Tier). In addition to its normal effects, your Unsettling Presence now increases your Will, and that of anyone deemed your ally, by +4 while they are within the effect range of Unsettling Presence, along with doubling the effectiveness of Unsettling Presence to -8 for saves against Fear effects and Will saves by -4 against targets you deem hostile inside your Unsettling Presence's range.
Ascendance has been added at level 30 (Epic Tier). Your Alternate Form now lasts indefinitely, however, Insurmountable lasts only the duration of rounds Alternate Form would last if you lacked Ascendance, and activates its count down upon assuming your Alternate Form. You may freely call upon Invocation and dismiss it at will as an Immediate Action as normal, and allowing you to enter and exit your Alternate Form when desired and as many times per day as you desire. In addition your Alternate Form gains the following increases; an additional +4 Strength, Constitution, and Dexterity, +7 more bonus AC in the form of Dodge, +10 additional stacking Spell Resistance, further Damage Reduction +10/Cold Iron, and another +5 Will.

- AF

2/02/13

4:12PM

Allocated appropriate amount of Spells per Day and their associated levels.
Adjusted formatting of Spells per Day (no longer has formatting glitches resulting in spare, unused columns).
Empowerment: Vengeful Return, level 10, now also heals the empowered individual 1/2 their Con modifier whenever they successfully deal melee damage, including through Vengeful Return.
Feral Soul now grants an additional bonus to Grappling at level 17 of +6.
Invocation and Alternate Form now mention that they render the individual immune to Transmutation effects unless desired and assuming Alternate Form allows the Champion of the Ferine to remove any unwanted Transmutation effects.
Invocation and Alternate Form now mentions that the transformation into and out of this form is a Immediate Action.
Spells no longer mention the removed Channeled Empowerment feature.
Improved the "Playing a Champion of the Ferine" section.
Removed Advancement subsection for the Champion of the Ferine.
Added the appropriate content for "Champions of the Ferine in the World".

NYI Empowerment: Wild Nullification has been added at level 21 (Epic Tier). All hostile spells or spell-like effects, including psi abilities and psi-like abilities, have a 25% chance to be reflected back to their caster.
NYI Scent of Blood has been added at level 21 (Epic Tier). If any attack in a Ferocious Assault critically strikes, your next attack gains a +5 attack roll bonus, and a +10 critical hit confirmation bonus if it also critically strikes.
NYI Sanguine Inheritance has been added at level 23 (Epic Tier). Your Strength, Dexterity, Constitution and Wisdom ability scores improve by +2, and your Animal Metabolism is doubled in effectiveness, now functioning as follows; the amount of health regained per turn is 2 hit points per every 4 levels of Champion of the Ferine; the minimal amount regenerated by Animal Metabolism is 2 hit points per turn, with the maximum being 10 per turn. This effect occurs even while the Champion is unconscious or otherwise unable to act, and is not effected by affects which prevent healing.
NYI Greater Blade of the Wild has been added at level 25 (Epic Tier). Your Blade of the Wild now also deals your Constitution modifier in bonus damage.
NYI Ascendance has been added at level 30 (Epic Tier). Your Alternate Form now lasts indefinitely, however, Insurmountable lasts only the duration of rounds Alternate Form would last if you lacked Ascendance. You may freely call upon Invocation and dismiss it at will, allowing you to enter and exit your Alternate Form when desired and as many times per day as you desire. In addition your alternate form gains the following increases; an additional +4 Strength, Constitution, and Dexterity, +7 more bonus AC in the form of Dodge, +10 additional stacking Spell Resistance, further Damage Reduction 10/Cold Iron, and another +5 Will.

- AF

1/29/13

12:04AM

NYI Empowerment: Wild Nullification has been added at level 21 (Epic Tier). All hostile spells or spell-like effects, including psi abilities and psi-like abilities, have a 25% chance to be reflected back to their caster.
NYI Scent of Blood has been added at level 21 (Epic Tier). If any attack in a Ferocious Assault critically strikes, your next attack gains a +5 attack roll bonus, and a +10 critical hit confirmation bonus if it also critically strikes.
NYI Sanguine Inheritance has been added at level 23 (Epic Tier). Your Strength, Dexterity, Constitution and Wisdom ability scores improve by +2, and your Animal Metabolism is doubled in effectiveness, now functioning as follows; the amount of health regained per turn is 2 hit points per every 4 levels of Champion of the Ferine; the minimal amount regenerated by Animal Metabolism is 2 hit points per turn, with the maximum being 10 per turn. This effect occurs even while the Champion is unconscious or otherwise unable to act, and is not effected by affects which prevent healing.
NYI Greater Blade of the Wild has been added at level 25 (Epic Tier). Your Blade of the Wild now also deals your Constitution modifier in bonus damage.
NYI Ascendance has been added at level 30 (Epic Tier). Your Alternate Form now lasts indefinitely, however, Insurmountable lasts only the duration of rounds Alternate Form would last if you lacked Ascendance. You may freely call upon Invocation and dismiss it at will, allowing you to enter and exit your Alternate Form when desired and as many times per day as you desire. In addition your alternate form gains the following increases; an additional +4 Strength, Constitution, and Dexterity, +7 more bonus AC in the form of Dodge, +10 additional stacking Spell Resistance, further Damage Reduction 10/Cold Iron, and another +5 Will.

- AF

1/28/13

10:48PM

Added Champion of the Ferine Campaign: Religion information.
Added Champion of the Ferine Campaign: Other Classes information.
Added Champion of the Ferine Campaign: Combat information.

- AF

1/27/13

6:43AM

Channeled Empowerment has been removed.
Unbound Channeling has been removed.
Empowerment has been added at level 6. Empowerment temporarily grants a Champion of the Ferine a chosen passive attack effect for a short duration. Empowering a weapon is a swift action and does not provoke an attack of opportunity for doing so. Empowerment lasts for 3 rounds when activated; Empowerment cannot be activated again until 3 rounds after its effects fade. You may only chose one Empowerment to be active at a time, but may freely switch between them whenever activating them next.

Empowerment: Savage Strikes: The threat range of your attacks is doubled, and all critical strikes gain a +5 confirmation bonus to succeed.
Empowerment: Vengeful Return: Any enemy who strikes you takes 1/2 your regular melee damage in physical damage once a round.
Empowerment: Untamed Power: Successful melee attacks now deal damage as nature (acid) instead of physical.
Empowerment: Maiming Wounds: Successful melee attacks by you slow the victim's movement speed by 1/2 until the start of your next turn.
Empowerment: Reckless Onslaught: Successful melee attacks deal half of your Strength modifier in physical damage to all targets within 5ft of your primary target.

Wrath of the Wild has been added at level 15. Blade of the Wild now deals 50% more damage if Untamed Power is active when Blade of the Wild is triggered.
Spell Resistance no longer stacks with sources other than Feral Soul and Invocation's Alternate Form.
The 9th level progression of Feral Soul no longer reduces Hide and Disguise checks by -4 in urban environments, but instead decreases a Champion of the Ferine's Charisma based checks (except for Intimidate) when dealing with creatures that are not animals by an additional -4.

- AF

1/26/13

10:09PM

Polished up the description of the class, while trying to keep to the original feel (backed up the original text if needed)
Moved the rules text for becoming an ex-Champion of the Ferine(and for atoning) to the proper section
Included the actual starting gold instead of a link to another class (may need to examine that, two handed weapons are expensive)

-C

1/26/13

7:23AM

NYI Channeled Empowerment has been removed.
NYI Unbound Channeling has been removed.
NYI Empowerment has been added. Empowerment temporarily grants a Champion of the Ferine a chosen passive attack effect for a short duration. Empowering a weapon is a swift action and does not provoke an attack of opportunity for doing so. Empowerment lasts for 3 rounds when activated; Empowerment cannot be activated again until 3 rounds after its effects fade. You may only chose one Empowerment to be active at a time, but may freely switch between them whenever activating them next.

NYI Empowerment: Savage Strikes: The threat range of your attacks is doubled, and all critical strikes gain a +5 confirmation bonus to succeed.
NYI Empowerment: Vengeful Return: Any enemy who strikes you takes 1/2 your regular melee damage in physical damage once a round.
NYI Empowerment: Untamed Power: Successful melee attacks now deal damage as nature (acid) instead of physical.
NYI Empowerment: Maiming Wounds: Successful melee attacks by you slow the victim's movement speed by 1/2 until the start of your next turn.
NYI Empowerment: Reckless Onslaught: Successful melee attacks deal half of your Strength modifier in physical damage to all targets within 5ft of your primary target.

NYI Spell Resistance no longer stacks with sources other than Feral Soul and Invocation's Alternate Form.
NYI The 9th level progression of Feral Soul no longer reduces Hide and Disguise checks by -4 in urban environments, but instead decreases a Champion of the Ferine's Charisma based checks (except for Intimidate) when dealing with creatures that are not animals by an additional -4.

- AF

1/25/13

3:47PM

Unshackled Movement now reads gender appropriate for the example Champion of the Ferine.
Channeled Empowerment now specifies that a "melee attack", for purposes the of channeling a spell via the class feature, can be either an armed or unarmed attack.
Shattering Roar now mentions that an attack of opportunity is still granted if the target meets the requirements while casting in melee range despite having also already triggered Shattering Roar, as originally intended.
Invocation now specifies that not only do you qualify as a Magic Beast, you are treated as one when beneficial in Alternate Form.

- AF

1/25/13

6:20AM

To note, major upgrades in lore and fluff would be appreciated whenever you find opportune or decide that there is a better means to add and include such content. I will be doing so myself in between augmenting and further supplementing the class with additions. A major section unfinished is Spells, as described before.

- AF

01/25/13

6:05AM

All races, no longer just humans and elves, may become Champions of the Ferine.
Base Attack Bonuses, Fortitude saves, Reflex saves and Will saves have been adjusted correctly.
Champions of the Ferine no longer have a free and immediate bonus attack via a claw attack, but instead learn Ferocious Assault at starting level. However, they still gain a natural proficiency for claw attacks, and a progressive claw attack as they increase their Feral Soul via levels.
Champions of the Ferine now learn Ferocious Assault at 1st level.
Feral Soul now grants Pounce at 1st level.
Feral Soul now grants an additive +2 to AC in the form of Natural Armor per level of ability score progression.
Feral Soul now grants an additive +5 Spell Resistance per level of ability score progression.
Invocation's AC bonus is now in the form of Dodge, and has been increased to +7, up from +5.
Invocation now grants an additive +10 Spell Resistance bonus while active.
Evasive Instinct now correctly notes that if the feat or class feature "Uncanny Dodge" is gained, that they will instead gain "Improved Uncanny Dodge" as if they already had "Uncanny Dodge".
Blade of the Wild is now an Extraordinary ability (Ex),and may now deal nature (acid) damage or physical damage in addition to its current effects.
Channeled Empowerment now functions with any melee attack dealt by the Champion of the Ferine, no longer just greatsword attacks.
Cull Weakness has been removed from the class.
Unbound Channeling has been added at level 7. Unbound Channeling allows a Champion of the Ferine to cast any touch spell they know as part of a full attack action, and the spell affects each target they hit in melee combat that round. Doing so discharges the spell at the end of the round, in the case of a touch spell that would otherwise last longer than 1 round.
Natural Immunity no longer reads as if it provides resistance to disease and poison, and correctly reads that it provides immunity to such effects.
Greater Ferocious Assault has been added at level 11.
Shattering Roar now correctly indicates that an enemy must make a Concentration (Wis) and succeed or lose their spell.
Shattering Roar and Horrifying Roar no longer use Intimidate (Cha) to determine their successes; the baseline DC has been increased instead.
Shattering Roar and Horrifying Roar now deal Sonic damage to victims in range.
Unsettling Aura now correctly has a chance for a creature to make a Save against the effect provided by the Champion of the Ferine.
Deafening Roar has been added.
Insurmountable's effect now lasts until Alternate Form fades.
Insurmountable now further emphasizes that the Champion of the Ferine is unkillable for the duration, but expires immediately after it ends.
Corrected numerous wording errors.
Skills:
- Gather Information (Wis) has been added to the Skill list.
- All skills have been alphabetized.

Huge edits made as per the discussion prior; there should be major and visible improvements, but many errors undoubtedly still exist. Your addition of Ferocious Assault has a great amount of character flavor and design fluidity, thank you for doing so.

- AF

01/25/13

>6:05AM

Made some of the formatting changes we discussed, BAB and Saves columns adjusted to match up with the standard numbers. Added Ferocious Assault (monk Flurry of Blows ability) as well as the short description section. Can't figure out what's causing the weird table formatting error. Will come back after some sleep to tackle some of the other changes discussed.

- C

Discussion[edit]

Feral Soul doesn't seem overpowered beyond making this class Barbarian+, the addition of channeling may push it past the stated goal of T3 though. Class very easily builds into a charger that does very credible damage without needing multiclassing or ACF stacking and I'm not sure that adding the duskblade's channel ability is necessary. May be worth considering dropping that entirely and building the spell list around utility/buff/bfc spells, which should make it hit T3 without overshooting to T2+

Still unsure about the claw attack. It doesn't do much currently and would be a subpar choice over using the twohander anyway. It's fluffy, but feels like it was just tacked on without consideration for the class abilities. Oh well, we have an appendix, CotF has a claw attack.

Spell Resist is poorly worded, currently stacks with ALL granted forms of spell resistance, including spells, magic items and race, don't think that was what you intended.

-4 penalty to hide/disguise checks at 9 seems unusual, consider an additional -2 to disguise and cha based skills besides intimidate instead? Looking odd doesn't normally make hiding difficult unless you glow or are unusually large (character is still medium sized, so not exactly "unusually large").

--C

Provided that it succeeds into entering a mid to high level tier 3 class (and could have the potential to cap out for this tier if someone truly invested a large amount of time and effort into min/maxing it in every sense of the phrase) I can agree that removing the channeled features is quite reasonable. My current suggestion is to instead provide a temporary (perhaps a few round duration, likely not more than 1d6) in the form of a beneficial effect channeled through their weapon; something that could allow a bit more quality, utility and fluff. In the case of replacing offensive channeling all together in the favor of this temporary offensive boost (via a limited set of special class-related spell-like abilities, likely no more than four or five) that could cause anything from minor to moderate cleave damage to enemies in burst, alter your physical damage into nature (acid) damage temporarily, or provide a very minor life steal effect.

That's not to say Feral Soul is weak, its just a bonus concept and might be a bit too much. Opinion? The idea at most simple is a limited and temporary, but optional and (possibly) beneficial modification to regular melee attacks (to provide a bit more utility and novelty). Think Blade of the Wild's nature (acid) damage as a temporary enchant on regular melee swings for 1d6 rounds. It would provide some unique occurrences with Ferocious Assault (wave of splash damage to everything in cone of five, for fun as an example) depending on one's Empowerment.

The claw attack is primarily designed to strictly be a bonus; while you can't enchant your claws or otherwise increase their effectiveness beyond what's given (barring Improved Natural Attack), they do provide piercing or slashing and give you a much more threatening and credible presence, even if you are disarmed. While an unlikely eventuality (but quite possible), it also is mainly a fluff component. It isn't meant to be your primary attack means (your chosen great blade is meant as that), but it might help stop a gap that could arise and just feels appropriate given the class lore and feel.

Would it stacking solely with Feral Soul's provided Spell Resistance be more appropriate, and not allowing other beneficial Spell Resistance effects to function unless they surpass the passive value given by Feral Soul (and Alternate Form when active)?

A very reasonable note; I am not entirely sure how to mechanically convey that a Champion of the Ferine simply fails to "blend" with society very easily. It would be credible, however, that their Charisma based checks with humanoids would drop a further -2 to -4 (and fits the overall fluff). NPC reactions should reflect that Champions of the Ferine are rather intimidating and somewhat reviled by most any civilized group (even a fair amount of Druids would reasonably find that Champions of the Ferine are a bit socially taboo); while they're willing to interact, it shouldn't come as a surprise if the town's guard is awfully weary of you. Intimidate should almost always be a Champion's go to social skill, provided the target is a humanoid.

I will absolutely consider making that adjustment to instead further lower their Charisma based checks with humanoids, except for Intimidate (which instead increases).

- AF

I like the Empowerment idea and you could wrap Blade of the Wild into it instead of having two class abilities that add acid damage. I think instead of the current timer you have, it may be worth having to sacrifice spell slots to it. A level 5 spell would grant 5 rounds of the ability and then another spell slot would need to be burned (any level, lasts that many rounds, Orisons last 1 round as well?). Using up the spell should remain a swift action. You could even break it up by level, granting the various abilities at higher levels (probably the best, class is already a very powerful dip, we need to avoid frontloading abilities).

Feral Soul is definitely not weak, but when I built a character at various breakpoints it didn't stand out as freakishly powerful. I just feel that the spell channeling ability could push it to that point (2d6+5d6+xx with a bonus +5 to hit from charging and Shocking Grasp's special rules at level 6 on top of the ever increasing str and con bonuses. SG is normally a 1st level spell so no issues using that every attack. Sneak in a few of the charge multipliers and it very quickly becomes an instant nuke. Then you get the full attack ability.) I do like the Empowerment change though, that's an interesting mechanic.

Claw attack will also add an additional attack to the Champion at a -5 penalty. It's so minor it hardly bears mentioning, but it's something. I'm really fine with it, just wish I could think up some ways to work it into the class as a whole that don't feel gimmicky and forced.

I think noting that the class granted spell resist only stacks with itself will be fine. Otherwise a Drow Champion of the Ferine will get a little silly. That's already a little silly(as in "Why would you do that?" silly), but I think we should avoid handing people the means to make characters with 60+ Spell Resistance right out of the box.

Adding penalties to cha based skills should accomplish that just fine. A predator shouldn't have any issues hiding or sneaking around, but you're probably going to be too weirded out by it to really be diplomatic and would be more likely to question bluffs, etc.

-C

Empowerment now begins at level 6 and scales through level 13, filling in several dead spaces (where you really got very little) along with making any dip in this class fairly costly to some better extent than that previously. Feel free to rearrange the way the Empowerment abilities progress level wise, and suggest major changes. They should cover all the bases while retaining their uniqueness as is and making the class distinct and functional.

Wrath of the Wild was added to make Blade of the Wild a bit more interesting and synergistic with Untamed Power (which is the pure nature (acid) damage Empowerment). It now allows Blade of the Wild to deal 50% more damage if Untamed Power is active, as Untamed Power should still be decently competitive in some light at higher levels. Switching between Empowerments should be a conscious and decided thing to do as battles progress.

Savage Strikes is designed to excel at single target damage; Reckless Onslaught to contend with masses of enemies, namely minions; Maiming Wounds to lock down and hamper highly mobile enemies; Untamed Power to overcome damage reduction (and now increase the effectiveness of attacks of opportunity) and Vengeful Return to provide deterrence to being swarmed. While none of them should be "awesome" (especially with the really short but decent duration of 3 rounds and cooldown of 3 rounds after (50/50 cycle of uptime)), they should all be very lucrative to a Champion to constantly exercise and adapt with, given their situation.

Any suggestions are welcome given the way the claw attack could be worked in, but as it is, I'm satisfied with it being an "iffy" bonus attack, and serving as the unarmed replacement, more or less. It just feels right for the class as is, but if a solution can be made to make it feel even better for the demeanor and design of the class, the better.

Spell Resistance has been modified accordingly; it strictly stacks with Feral Soul and Invocation now. This should alleviate the overwhelming stacking issue now; I may in the future consider allowing racial Spell Resistance to be included (to keep the class lucrative to any race which might, for whatever reason, have racial Spell Resistance).

A legitimate point regarding the sneaking or hiding, the primary concern was to further emphasize their "sore thumb" state in urban environments. Unsettling Presence alone really hinders that, by design (while things may not be aware of you specifically, they get the sensation of the hairs on the back of their neck standing on end). Anyone interacting with the character short of the party, animals, Magical Beasts or other Champions of the Ferine should find the class difficult to interact socially with.

I highly appreciate the edits on the wording; it reads much more smoothly and efficiently.

- AF

I'm not keen on base classes proficiencies in only one or two specific weapons. It just doesn't make sense to me that the entirety of one class train exclusively with a greatsword and nothing else. That might make sense for a prestige class (at which point it becomes a prerequisite). It feels at odds with the feral theme, too. I would drop it to Simple weapons - I mean, they get a bunch of Strength bonuses and enchanted claws anyway. Well, you asked :) Marasmusine (talk) 15:24, 4 February 2013 (MST)

Understandably so; the particular idea was to narrow down the design into a few ideals, and the greatsword feature was something that helped do that, along with keeping the theme of Paladin-Druid. More or less, both choices were for thematic and novelty reasons (the whole idea of a feral class using heavy armor and wielding a greatsword is a bit surprising, if not mildly confusing).

All the same, I appreciate the assessment and the time you put into doing so. I have a few other classes planned in the future under a similar genre with more classical and some more atypical elements.

--Argent Fatalis (talk) 15:36, 5 February 2013 (MST)

some slight issues. Formatting is a big one throughout. Also for a base class this gives really high bonuses to stats and saves, along with heavy armor and lots of nat armor. Suggestions are the following the speed bonus should go away (heavy armor reduces, that is why the barbarian uses light for its armor selection) the +12 to strength and con (plus natural magical weapons that inflict 3d6 before you take improved natural attack) is excessive for a medium sized creature. An additional + 5 to all saves puts this character at 17 with better saves than most epic 21st characters. The alternate form bonuses as they stack are also incredibly high for a base creature. If you want this on the "Tier" scale it is at least a two since you would be able to take most things without an outside neutralizer, and if you take the right items you could easily neutralize tier one with this. Tivanir (talk) 15:04, 8 April 2013 (MDT)

As an aside this thing is also ridiculously easy to break so I don't think it is a what you are hoping for at this time. Just a few quick examples that would make this thing an overweight powerhouse 1) monks belt. 2) cloak of resist +5 3) enchantments for armor and nat armor. Just the monks belt will give you +d6 to your abilities; add in improved natural attack and you are up to 5d6 with attacks for two weapon fighting to be +24x4 +19 x2 +14x2 +9x2 (note that is just strength, two weapon fighting feats and nothing else.) your saves will be (before modifiers) 17 11 17 and going off of the cloak and minimum adjustments 28 19 24 (this is before the actual stats themselves; you can easily boost dex and make them all over 20.) All of that is off the first base ability and doesn't even account for spells, the multitude of tracker feats, the uncanny dodge or the druid shapeshifting talent. Taking a step back and looking at it from an objective standpoint it looks like you tried to give a base fighter class flurry of blows (iffy) a personal magic item that can't be dispelled, huge saves, tracker feats, the were-tiger template with more con and armor (+9 LA by itself), plus spells the monks hand to hand abilities, heavy armor and a slew of other things. This class by itself could easily take a same level wizard by the simple fact you would never fail a save. This would need more than a little pruning to be viable in 3.5e standard and actually would probably fit in with RoW as it currently stands with no modifications. Tivanir (talk) 17:46, 8 April 2013 (MDT)

Alright here are my suggestions to prune this thing down to 3.5e warblade on par level: Dump the spells (you don't need them anyways and it wasn't even something I addressed for the simple fact that everything else is still so powerful that they are unnecessary), drop the hand to hand down to greatsword level (with the monks belt and improved natural attack you can still get it to 4d6 but at least that caps under the monks 4d8 with improved natural attack), drop the every 4 levels bonus saves and instead go with increasing all base saves to good (as it stands starting with a save of 19 prior to stat line the morph or magic items on the weakest save is really really high), remove unshackled movement or change the armor to light (like a barbarian so the ability itself makes sense - also uncanny dodge like ability makes more sense with a light armor individual not heavy), remove greater ferocious assault, cut the bonuses by half for stat adjustments (even prestige classes don't give anywhere near this many adjustments. maybe make it pick and choose between 3 stats every four levels for a boost of 2.) Primal will is exceptionally powerful (freedom of movement at 7th level is incredibly powerful - especially when you combine it with a speed boost since you can charge right through web and pretty much everything else) so either make it more 14-15th level or limit it to a single round, natural immunity to level 13, Remove unbound agility (this is completely armor breaking there is a reason bracers of armor exist - it allows you plate armor level protection with as much dex as you can bring to the table), vengeful return removed (half damage plus heal you not really a good ability for a warrior type - you could keep but reduce the damage returned to 1/4 and remove the heal; you are suppose to be part of a party not self sufficient), timeless body removed or moved to 19th, shattering roar shouldn't allow the attack of opportunity and should be moved to 16th with a cool down of at least 2 rounds (otherwise you just stunlock essentially an opponent forever), horrifying roar causes shaken and if it fails no effect, reckless onslaught removed (or it would have to deal damage to EVERYONE around the target not just enemies), deafening roar reduced to 15 + str fort save - 5d6 damage deafened for one round (currently you would just use it in place of the shattering roar to cause the damage and force a failure on the concentration check, blade of the wild shouldn't be anything but physical, and about all of the remaining abilities would be supernatural in nature not extraordinary. In short Ex is for things that are out of the ordinary Su is for things that mimic spells like acid attacks. Like I said originally this thing needs major pruning before you can even attempt a dry run at averaging it against a war blade. - Tivanir (talk) 10 April 2013 (MDT)

Ok I ran the numbers and this thing is actually more powerful then the tenken with its current setup (even with the recent deductions.) based on a stat line of 16 14 13 12 10 8 (non optimized) I can kill a Balor in a single round (the first with pounce) reliably which shouldn't occur. Further with having 184.5 k left I had saves of 31 fort 26 will 25 reflex and that is before the alternate form. Damage is 32-60 per hit and the lowest two attacks are +24 (I can easily bring those up to minimum to hit the galore AC with the 184k left.) you won't fail the saves will have an AC of 53 resist all elements at 25 or 35 in your alternate form. 420 hp, and fast healing five - these are the straight numbers and don't account for the other abilities or the spells. This thing is completely unplayable by regular 3.5e standards and would easily destroy everything between interrupts, massive damage and huge saves. Tivanir (talk) 10:35, 11 April 2013 (MDT)

In short this class is about to receive an imminent update of massive proportions (going from 1.3.0 to 2.0.0) from myself for balancing based on some of your suggestions. The following are things that I am absolutely going to rework:

Unbound Agility: Will now remove the Armor Check penalty for wearing Plate instead of removing the Maximum Dexterity Bonus penalty.
Natural Armor (and Dodge Bonuses): Will likely be reduced by around 1/2.
Bonus Saves: Only Alternate Form will grant bonuses to Will, Reflex and Fortitude.
Primal Will: Will now only grant the Champion of the Ferine immunity to slowing effects instead of all effects that impede movement.
Vengeful Return: Now deals 1/2 Strength modifier damage instead of 1/2 weapon damage.
Reckless Onslaught: This ability now deals damage to allies within range.
Deafening Roar: DC reduced. Lasts 1d3 rounds.
Terrifying Roar: DC reduced.
All Roars: Damage dealt by the roar is equal to a regular melee swing, as Sonic.
Blade of the Wild: Adjusted to Supernatural effect.

Content that is not receiving changes:

Ability Score Adjustments: It is part of the class and a passive, predictable scaling. Whereas Wizards, Clerics and Druids grow by leaps and bounds because of the spells per day table, Champions of the Ferine advance consistently.
Greater Ferocious Assault: Currently this progression is the same as a Monk's Flurry of Blows.
Natural Immunity: Poison and disease like effects should never be a present danger to a Champion of the Ferine, level 9 is a very fitting place.
Timeless Body: Like Natural Immunity, by the time a Champion of the Ferine acquires this ability, it isn't amazing; games starting at or above level 10, yes, it is exceptionally good, but I have no intentions to balance for games like that.
Shattering Roar: If a spellcaster is within reach of a Champion of the Ferine and casts spells, they deserve to be hit.

Anything I missed?

--Argent Fatalis (talk) 15:18, 12 April 2013 (MDT)

Looks a lot more balanced I will give it a good in context look over and give you anything else that stands out as truly overpowering. Tivanir (talk) 13:21, 15 April 2013 (MDT)

One last thing that jumps out. You can use the alternate form at level one, so at level one three times a day you get DR 20/cold iron. This should be changed to be 5/cold iron; at 15th level 10/cold iron (cold iron weapons are not common at all so the lower DR makes more sense otherwise hurting you becomes near impossible.) Tivanir (talk) 13:36, 15 April 2013 (MDT)

Epic isn't actually too bad the only thing I would do is drop the Cold Iron down to 25 total at 30. Other than that it seems good. Tivanir (talk) 13:43, 15 April 2013 (MDT)

Alternate Form is gained through Invocation at the 17th level; I can see your confusion though, as it is listed as part of Feral Soul. I should probably rectify this under its own section at level 17 and not under Feral Soul, despite it canonically being part of Feral Soul. As for the damage reduction type itself, Cold Iron was chosen as it fits thematically (Silver was not selected because they are not Lycanthrope or "impure" and are more closely related to true Fey-beasts, hence why Alternate Form makes them a true Magical Beast whenever it benefits them). As for how much DR, at level 17 I believe DR 20/Cold Iron is a pretty hefty boon, especially for a major class feature.

As for the Epic tier Alternate Form, Ascendance, I am not entirely sure just how much damage things put out at level 30, as I've never even thought of, nor heard of a game going beyond 20 more or less. Is DR 40/Cold Iron particularly powerful or balanced or underpowered?

--Argent Fatalis (talk) 14:46, 15 April 2013 (MDT)

the suggestions were actually based off the DnD damage reduction chart. DR /magic is the least useful (magic isnt hard to come by) so big numbers on that aren't terrible but shouldn't exceed 1/HD. Uncommon substances (like cold iron) are a lot more useful because most things you encounter won't have it and shouldn't exceed 2/HD. DR that can't be negated is obviously the most powerful and is 3 divided into HD. Prestige classes tend to bend these rules a bit but overall that is the average, because the DR is suppose to be good just not overpowering. Heck fighting anything and probably being able to take off 15-25 hp per hit is still really powerful since that can double or more your hp (depending on opponent) and your AC is still going to be really high with the class so it makes it extraordinarily hard to kill for a base class. Tivanir (talk) 05:51, 16 April 2013 (MDT)

The damage reduction has been reduced to Damage Reduction 15/Cold Iron for Invocation and Ascendance, which is as far as I'll lower it for the sake of balance, as it should intentionally eat up massive portions of incoming damage, as after all, this is one of the major class features, has a limit for duration and uses per day, and is not unlocked until a decently high level.

--Argent Fatalis (talk) 07:39, 16 April 2013 (MDT)

Looks good for the most part at this point. The only thing you may wish to address is the spells from what I see. If you are going to let them have over third level spells it should come from a specific spell list (wizard cleric druid not a combination of the three) or you should adjust it down to level 3 for maximum spell level. It is a powerhouse in the fighting rind still, even with the reduction it has undergone, but those spells bring up additional questions on balance (especially the multiple spell lists part.) Other than that it might be a little on the high side but I could probably allow this into a campaign now. Tivanir (Speak to me) (talk) 13:43, 18 April 2013 (MDT)

There shouldn't be issues for multiple spells as it casts all of them as a Divine caster without need for preparation, making them all spontaneous in nature. I wouldn't so much consider reducing the level of the spells they have access to, just the amount, but if that's ever been done, I am unsure, as most of the spells it has in its library are thematically appropriate or are functionally appropriate (Fly, Anti-Magic effects, Remove Disease/Poison/Fear). My only concern is they can cast too many per day, not so much what they can cast, especially if their list is not going to expand further.

--Argent Fatalis (talk) 17:35, 18 April 2013 (MDT)

I meant mainly that other casters have to take levels in different classes in order to access divine and arcane spells. True strike is wiz/sor and assassin but the cures are divine. It would be better if you stuck to a single list generation (any of them is fine) if you like the 5th level spells but right now I count at least two and probably more if I look through all the spells. The number of spells is actually fine. Tivanir (Speak to me) (talk) 19:34, 18 April 2013 (MDT)

Talk:Champion of the Ferine (3.5e Class)

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