Talk:Oath of the Silver Hand (5e Subclass)

Please, give me some feedback if you have any thoughts on this archetype. I actually just completed something that was stuck since march of this year and completed, so it is likely to have some issues. I've done the Path of the Titanborn and am working on the College of Subterfuge atm as well, so as i'm monitoring them all, any feedback is apreciated. - Dhunter2

Hello, fellow wikian! As requested, here are my suggestions and opinions on this archetype:

• Channel Divinity: Light of Dawn. Uh, are you exactly sure you want multiplying basis on that? Notice that the heal spell restores 70 hit points, which you can do as well at 14th level and 20 (+5) Charisma. Now this is your normal cap, but when you implement some things else that grants you even more Charisma scores, the things are very easy to scale and terribly overpowered at some situations. I suggest something in par with 1d10 + your paladin level, because that's what fighter's Second Wind feature does.

You might want something like Lay on Hands feature but at a safe distance, right? Why not make a separate class feature that allows you to use your Lay on Hands feature on other creatures you can see within 30 feet of you (with the exception of constructs and undeads, of course)?

• Channel Divinity: Quake Hammer. Save DC must be your paladin spell save DC, you should mention that. While the area-of-effect insta-knockdown effect is very impressive, maybe it is a bit too impressive, especially when you can choose who to knock prone and who to keep standing. I suggest reducing the size a little bit, and while you're at it, make it indiscriminating so that you will keep yourself deep within your enemies' range to crowd-control while your allies spam some things else at a safe distance.

• Aura of The Silver Shield. AC bonus is nice and all, but the size is unorthodox at 7th level (why not 10 feet, like every other paladin auras?) and full Charisma modifier bonus at 18th level is too strong. Notice that Aura of Protection gains only aura size increase at 18th level.

• Renew the Vow. Modifying spell level is discouraged in 5th edition. I suggest you might find some suggestions and reference from cleric's Life Domain for boosting your healing capability.

• Avenging Crusher. I don't find this feature very in par with other features. Other features were based on how a paladin becomes a dedicated healer and mighty tanker of the party; this feature is more of a paladin as a bruiser. You might want to reconsider some options or two, or find a way to integrate both features. I see that your attack now replenishes your Lay on Hands feature, but by 20th level you'll need more than that to keep yourself active enough.

• Suggestions. I see this archetype is heavily inspired by paladins (especially Uther the Lightbringer) from Warcraft franchise, yesno? This is just my crazy idea that you can totally ignore, but I think the paladin could be very interesting if you integrate some features of Auriel from Heroes of the Storm. I know she isn't from the Warcraft franchise (she's actually from Diablo) but her skillsets could help you design a decent, dedicated healer with moderate to actually very impressive close-combat skills.

--WeirdoWhoever (talk) 23:32, 26 September 2017 (MDT)

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Thank you for your feedback! Let me try to answer each issue separately:

Channel Divinity: Light of Dawn. Well, i tried to implement something close to on par with the Life Domain's Channel Divinity, but i totally forgot about Charisma improving features, well thought buddy! Although i don't think it is enough to simply give in a value similar to Fighter's Second Wind because i figured this would be the place where i would achieve to give him some healing capabilities in earlier levels. So much that i thought improving the uses of the feature at the 15th level a good way to help in progression while making up for his reduced spell slots issue. My first thought as to how to par him on to other main healers was to use the Lay On Hands feature entirely, but i don't think it is a good idea and would be hard to balance.

Channel Divinity: Quake Hammer. Humm, well, i do agree that maybe the 20 feet area of effect was too much, since although it is smaller than the normally 60 feets of some paladin traits that causes a fear like effect in their enemies, it hits every enemy, excludes friends and has no type restriction. Accepting that, i don't think that it is necessary to reduce the range AND make it hit indiscrimated targets, as i think that either would be enough to balance the effect. As a Channel Divinity that brings the heaven's fury to the mortal domain and punishes your enemies, i think that reducing the area of effect to a 10 feet radius while mantaining the restrictions to friendly fire to be more natural, but i find the on the crowds skirmisher idea quite awesome too >=D

Aura of The Silver Shield. Totally agree with the full Charisma bonus to your AC at the 17th level, this was here before i started the reformulation. Yet the unorthodox 15 feet radius is not unmotivated, i purposely made it a bit bigger to have effective use for the Lay On Hands extension feature. To make it from a 5 feet range effect to a 10 feet would not be really much of an improvement in my opininion. I'll accept the suggestion and shange it to an orthodox range while having a separate feature to apply the Lay On Hands effect then.

Renew the Vow. I will look to it, but as you probably have guessed, i'm not particularly fond of being making the class suffer in exchange of following the handbook policy xD. I always try to make compromises when i can and if the Handbook the handbook has a good approach, i always try to follow it if i can.
edit: As i figured, Cleric's Life Domain features won't cut it. They help clerics a lot because they have such a big arsenal of spell slots and high level spells at that too and they sinergyze well because they stack. But paladins have a limited number os spell slots and can only use 5th spell slots at most, so the same feature will have a significantly reduced effect at them and be underpar. As i said, i don't specially like to distance myself from the Handbook rules, but to treat a Life Domain's Cleric and Paladin Healer the same way is not always going to work. (#SadLife) If you happen to have another concrete suggestion, feel free to post it, as i'm not really against considering changes.

Avenging Crusher. Well, he is a healer, but he's still a paladin. It's not like he will spend all his time in healing just as a Cleric of the Life Domain will often strike his enemies with spells. I just thought that his base class had enough of offense capabilities and that it was just enough even if i didn't add anything. Also, this feature does not replenish Lay On Hands. The intention was that this "health pool" that was mentioned to be immediately spent to heal allies inside of your aura range, so he wouldn't need to spend a whole action to cast Lay On Hands and be capable of healing immediately, as well as not being capable of storing the pool to later use. It seems it was not very clear about it, so your statement was a great help because i didn't notice xD

Suggestions. Promise i'll look it soon and may have some good inspiration, thanks for the advice! This archetype is by no means complete, i'm regularly monitoring the archetypes i have contributed to and i'm open to changes. Your feedback is highly appreciated!!!
edit: Did you mean about her passive ability to story energy from a fraction of the damage dealt around her to convert as healing? That sure is an interesting feature for a frontline healer and i'll need some thinking before being capable of implementing that, but the concept is amazing!!!

- Dhunter2

Aura of The Silver Shield, who is affected?

Not sure if I am asking this in the right spot, but I was wondering who gets the bonus to AC in the aura? Just allies or allies AND the Paladin? My current Paladin has a 23 AC (10 + (+2) Dwarven Plate + Shield + Defensive fighting style (gives a +1 to AC if wearing armor) = 23. So is this aura gives me the bonus (my Charisma is a 20 so a +5 mod to give allies a +3 to their AC), my AC would become 26. I doubt my DM will allow that but I figured I would try to clarify here anyways.

Answer: Yes, it does, as he's inside the aura as well. Gonna fix that, thanks!