Talk:Oath of the Lich-Servant (5e Subclass)

Hello again, fellow wikian! I love the very idea of evil paladins (or blackguards, as they were called long ago, about an edition before or two) and this archetype seems nice for the purpose. However, here are some proposals I would like to make:

• Premise. Although I love the idea and all, I'm terribly sorry to tell you that the concept of archetype seems to overlap with the Oathbreaker archetype, featured in Dungeon Master's Guide. Maybe it could be used to improve your work, I recommend you check it out.

• Channel Divinity: Both of them. You need to make sure what kind of action you need to use the Channel Divinity feature. I suppose both seems appropriate to use a bonus action, but still, you have to write that.

• Channel Divinity: Deathly Force. Deal an extra damage with what? A melee weapon attack? A spell? A ranged weapon attack (I know it's unlikely, but still)? If it means "you deal an extra damage with a melee weapon attack", I suggest it's kinda redundant, considering that a paladin already have Divine Smite and Improved Divine Smite feature that does the exactly same thing, with even better damage output.

• Channel Divinity: Undeath Surge. Like fighter's Second Wind feature, right? This would make a tougher paladin, which makes a good tank for a party. Not bad, I think.

• Lich-Servant. Oh yes, being a servant of lich does come with a goodie or two! I like the concept of this feature.

• Aura of Undeath. I love the concept of this feature as well, but the mechanics might be a bit too awkward, I suppose? Again, free and passive hit point regeneration is highly discouraged in D&D, the DC calculation is somewhat unusual (not that it's bad, but still), and the idea of "reviving a fallen comrade as a zombie" is very unique but not exactly well performed.

I suggest giving the entire party an ability to drop to 1 hit point, once per long rest. This will put them in a risky situation, yes, but it is a confirmed method from many racial and class features from PHB. If you happen to consider this option, I'll leave my version here for reference: Whenever you or a friendly creature within 10 feet of you drop to 0 hit points, it can instead choose to drop to 1 hit point. When the creature does so, it gains temporary hit points equal to its Costitution modifier (a minimum of 1), and cannot benefit from this feature until it finishes a long rest. At 18th level, the range of this aura increases to 30 feet.

• Undead Resistance. Resistance against acid and poison damage, plus saving throw advantage against being poison. A good feature, I say. Maybe it could be a bit improved, since being if being a servant of a lich grants them resistance to poison like undeads do, maybe they can be totally immune to poison.

• Master of Undeath. Awkward and breaks the spell slot system as a whole, I'm afraid to say. Besides, it's a bit too weak for a 20th-level feature, commonly called as a "capstone", since this is, well, a reward for you to be a full-level paladin. From what I've read from my copy of PHB, a paladin capstone usually involves the paladin himself/herself becoming something divine or at least strange, giving them a massive bonus for a short period.

I recently did a rework of a sorcerer archetype called Necromancy Bloodline, and I attempted to simulate the lich's phylactery as a quasi-capstone feature. I must be boasting with this one, but I recommend considering this option as well, because the feature sounds super appropriate for a lich's helping hand.

• Other suggestions. I am a man of stereotype, so when I come across a class archetype option involving death and undeath, I can only suggest a fixed amount of ideas. I hope some of my rather bland ideas would help your work:

3rd-level feature makes the Divine Smite damage type necrotic.

When you kill a humanoid with a melee weapon attack plus Divine Smite, you raise it as a zombie under your control. You can raise a limited amount of zombie this way.

A Channel Divinity option allows you to take control of one or more undead creature - see cleric's Channel Divinity:: Turn/Destroy Undead for reference.

Well, that's it for now. In short: Love the concept, but some feature could be improved. I'm planning to have a lich in my upcoming campaign, and I can't wait to have a good lich-servant as a mid-boss or a flunky for the old dead witch.

Oh, and I must apologize, I must be nitpicking. Please, please let me know if this bothers you to any extent. I should get rid of my bad habit. --WeirdoWhoever (talk) 00:29, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

Dear AngelsAndAarakocra - I did some clean-up job here. It's mostly formatting, and some parts that are kinda redundant are clipped out. (For example: Since temporary hit points are supposed to be gone after a long rest, I erased the duration part from Soul Ward feature.) It must be kinda rude to do the edit without telling you first, but I guarantee, I did not touch anything that might be sensitive. Still, my apologies.

You will find some words I added with parenthesis. The current wordings seemed kinda vague, so I would like you to elaborate on some parts. For example: What action do I use to activate the Channel Divinity options? Are you sure it's Charisma score, not modifier? (Not many features refer to ability score rather than modifier, I was just checking.)

Oh, and I added the Tenet part for more fluffs. If a paladin serves a lich, there must be some codes or "house rules" that keep them that way. (Oathbreaker is kinda irregular, since it is basically a paladin who, well, broke his/her oath.)

I hope this would you further develop your wonderful archetype. --WeirdoWhoever (talk) 01:43, 24 May 2017 (UTC)

P.S. Oh, and I'm moving this page to "Oath of the Lich-Servant (5e Archetype)" for formatting reasons. --WeirdoWhoever (talk) 01:43, 24 May 2017 (UTC)

Name

I think that this should be renamed to Oath of the Lich-Servant to fit the other paladin oaths (Oath of Devotion, Oath of Vengeance etc.). SirSprinkles (talk) 00:38, 7 April 2017 (UTC)