Talk:Master of the Sword (5e Class)

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Quite a few dead levels. Also, why are there so many Extra Attacks? SirSprinkles (talk) 01:54, 31 March 2016 (MDT)

Trying to help keep this class on the wiki[edit]

I would like to help make this class better as in balancing the class. I have a few ideas for how to help the class because after looking over it the path of the mind is very op. But I do not think there should be any other changes to the class for it is very reasonable. It is a more offensive fighter really, but that can only use swords. But to get to it here is my sugetion on how to help the class.

(When you take this path at 3rd level you focus on honing your mind and mental abilities to become the ultimate fighter. After a long rest you can spend 1/2 an hour meditating and gain advantage on all Saving Throws and skill checks until your next short or long rest.) --This will most likely need to be changed to all advantages to some. I would most likely make it you can choose saving throws or skills and you are able to choose depending on your proficiency bonus or maybe even you level. This would help with just how op the play will be right at the start.-- -- I would also like to say that maybe it should be changed to an hour instead of 1/2 of a hour.--

(When you reach 4th level in this class you master the body and the ability to minute the amount of damage done to you, when you take a long rest you can spend an extra hour on your meditation to gain resistance to Piercing, Slashing and Bludgeoning until your next short or long rest.) --This is where I see the most problem with the class. You shouldn't be able to just take half damage from everything from just meditating for an hour. What it should bee is that you are able to choose one and only one of the to be able to take half damage from.-- --I see no need to change the time also--

(When you reach 6th level in this class you master the mind and skill, you become proficient in all saving throws and gain proficiency in 5 skills, additionally you can double your proficiency bonus to any skill check or saving throw you make you are proficient in.) --For this one I really don't know what you should change it too. It seems so out of place really. I would say to maybe change it to that they become proficient in in intelligence and wisdom, but not all.-- --I would say take the away the additional 5 skills.-- --I do think that the doubling your proficiency bonus is very cool and should still be there.-- --This part of the mind is just very out of place, and maybe should be replaced with a damage up instead.--

(When you reach 14th level in this class you become a master of the mind and control of the body, with utter control of your every action and movement, you can triple your dexterity modifier to your AC, also if you meditate 2 hours after a long rest you can make it so that all damage dice rolled against you automatically roll 1's, additionally you have advantage on ALL skill checks, saving throws, spell saves, and stat based rolls.) --Now this is a very big issue with just how op you can get all of a sudden. I think this should stay on how it is, but less everything and more choose a couple.-- --I do like the triple your dexterity, but maybe make it double instead, and have it only happen if you take that two extra hours to meditate.-- --Now the dice rolling this is very cool. But it should be changed you can do this only once per round, or maybe make it go off of your proficiency modifier.-- --Now I think instead of all it should only be two or maybe even one of the saving rolles. This is just so it make the play way more balanced.--

I really do love this class so much and I would like to help make it better. If you like what I have said to change please message me back, and I would like to work with you to help the class.

I say make it a fighter archetype. The OP clearly had trouble stretching it over 20 levels. Marasmusine (talk) 02:02, 10 May 2016 (MDT)
I see what you mean with the archetpye, but I feel that the empty levels are acceptable because of the other potent abilities obtained. The fact that the class has few skills outsides of the medication or bladeshield makes it function like a shotgun, just point and shoot.
Empty levels suck! That was the lesson learned in 3.5e, no-one wants to level up and get nothing. WoTC recognized this and published optional rules for 3.5e classes that filled in the dead levels. 4e and 5e design has no dead levels.
I can see straight away that there's three levels where you get two features, they can be spread out.
The paths add features at 4th, 6th and 13th, so these should be entered on the table, but I recommend moving these to 6th, 9th and 13th.
The AC bonus granted by bladeshield doesn't scale correctly, generally speaking +1 is a good bonus, +2 is great, +3 is exceptional. At 11th level, this guy is getting +7.
Path of the Blade:
Double proficiency on attack rolls all the time is overpowered. The PHB says that in general you do not get double prof. on attack rolls or saving throws.
Double all damage all the time is very overpowered. This is actually better than getting a critical with every hit, and it is combined with the +prof damage bonus and the die rerolls. The attack and damage bonuses at 14th level become obscene. The disarming rule shows a lack of knowledge on how 5e disarming works (and of how DC scales, but if this is rewritten correctly there will be no need for a DC)
Path of the Mind has similar problems, not quite meshing with 5e design and scaling.
I offer my services for rewriting this class, per User:Marasmusine#Need a rewrite? Marasmusine (talk) 02:32, 16 May 2016 (MDT)
I see what someone did for the weapon disarming, but Eldritch Knights are unable to lose their weapons, why not give this class the same ability, only it's based skill instead of magic.
Also, for Blade Shield, why not make it the number of extra attacks and proficiency bonus. That way it's less than Half the class level and extra attacks, but still increases at a good rate.
One last thing, does this class need so many fighting styles, it's only going to be able to make use of maybe 2 at a time, one of which being the one that adds 1 AC.
I see what you mean on Eldritch Knight but skill of a fighter means he can be disarmed by someone stronger.
Add Extra Attacks and proficiency? Level 1 to 4 +2 AC, Level 5 to 8 +4 AC, Level 9 to 10 +5 AC, Level 11 to 12 +6 AC, Level 13 to 16 +7 AC, Level 17 +8 AC and Level 18 to 20 +9 AC. Lighter Armor 12 + 5(Dex)= 17 + 9(Blade Shield)= 26 AC. Could work but it seems you would basically be the Tank of the group.
I see your point, but the AC bonus seems really low now, like painfully low.
Now they have a slowly building AC Bonus, and they can attack with an off hand once. If they had an off hand anyways.
I suggest play testing it. If it seems lacking write it up and we work it out. Maybe add Dodge with the ability?

Can I be honest, does anyone else see any benefit to being able to make slashing weapons to piercing or bludgeoning?

Some enemies are resistance to slashing or some DM require you to use bludgeoning to knock out opponents.

Try and keep the AC bonuses to +3 or below. How long does the benefit from Blade Shield last? Marasmusine (talk) 14:39, 8 July 2016 (MDT)

The turn I believe, the idea, I think, is that you use your blade solely to parry attacks. Grimeagle4 (talk) 01:07, 9 July 2016 (MDT)
Maybe it could use the existing mechanic for parrying, then. Also, as written, you get the blade shield AC against ranged attacks. Marasmusine (talk) 02:32, 9 July 2016 (MDT)
You mean dodge? The AC bonus scales with the class and only usable when they forgo attacks. Its a fair ability, compared to Bladesinging Arcane Tradition which gets a bonus to their AC equal to their Intelligence modifier and that's an a official ability in D&D.
I mean parry, such as the fighter battle master's parry, and the monk's deflect missiles.
I haven't seen the bladesinging arcane tradition yet, can you give me a link? If it is for a wizard, does the archetype also give you proficiency with medium armor? Marasmusine (talk) 02:15, 15 July 2016 (MDT)
Its in the Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide Book. They get proficiency in light armor, one-handed weapon of their choice and Performance. You can only use it twice and regain all uses on a rest. While active you get AC equal to your Int Mod, Increasing movement by 10ft, Advantage on Dex(Acrobatics), any Con saving throw gets your Int mod added. 6th level you get an extra attack. 10th level, as a reaction you can expend a spell to negate damage(Damage - (Spell Level x 5)), 14th level, add Int mod to your melee damage and this is all last 1 min.
Parry requires a resource but deflect missile cost a reaction. I think I like the idea that a warrior is dodging a opponents attacks and is harder to hit because he is proficient at dodging.

Can we please put something other than giving the class so many fighting styles. It's really unneeded. Grimeagle4 (talk) 00:27, 15 July 2016 (MDT)

I think a player only needs 2 fighting styles. The problem is someone going dislike "Dead levels" and no one has come up something better yet.
If you look at pathfinder, there are classes there with dead levels, yeah it sucks, but hey... Actually, a stupid thought. What about at certain levels, the higher ones, the class gets to pick a feat. but the only feats that can be chosen are those that have str, dex, or con requirements. Yeah stupid idea, but I'm honestly trying. Grimeagle4 (talk) 12:13, 20 July 2016 (MDT)
Its not a bad idea. But which ones that will help and not feel bland. Everyone can get those feats so maybe a upgraded version?

If we want to add in stuff for more levels the making attacks magical for overcoming resistance can be done, also maybe some sort of more power full/multi target/both slash attacks which would prob work on Dex/Str mod per short/long rest(1000 cuts just starts sooner and with scaling, also no encounters in 5e) Avaloon (talk) 10:04, 22 may 2017 pacific

Fixed balancing. The class has few dead levels. Lots of flavor with fighting styles. And reworked features. Class has lots of diversity now. 5/24/17 7:56 pm eastern


Okay, let's see what's changed since I was last here.

  • Having dozens of fighting styles dilutes the flavour of the class, and many of the styles are ill-defined. Some are near useless (sword hunter - tell me how many monsters in the MM have a magic sword?), some are overpowered (Dismemberment), some use non 5e terminology (Sword and Shield - 5e doesn't have "free actions"), some make no sense (Demonic Blade - "lose 5 life"?, "add 2 hit die to your damage roll"? Multiclassing information is incorrect.
  • You've got class features on levels where you already gain an ASI: In fact, you gain two extra features in most cases. And yet at 9th and 13th, you gain nothing. Please look at feature spread.
  • Blade Shield. Ambiguous wording. I'm sure you don't mean that attacks against enemies have disadvantage. It must mean that enemies have disadvantage on their attack rolls, right? How often can this be used, it surely can't be permanent, right?
  • Reach. How does this work. Is it your arms that suddenly get longer, or do the weapons extend somehow? Why is "no disadvantage" mentioned? You would not normally have disadvantage with reach weapons anyway.
  • Fancy Footwork. Wording should be "Your speed increases by 5 feet." Please consider disallowing this if they are wearing heavy armor.
  • Path of the Blade.
    • No, you don't get extra attack at 3rd level. Especially since you also get an extra attack at 5th level. You also have to say exactly how many extra attacks you have. It's not just +1 attack, as it doesn't stack when multiclassing Look at how it's worded in the PHB.
    • +1 to +3 to attack rolls and +2 to +6 to damage rolls with weapons. This is overpowered for a single feature.
    • Another extra attack at 7th level? This is ridiculous. I'm done with this archetype.
  • Path of the Mind.
    • You broke the AC cap. With a Dex of 20 and a shield, my AC is 24 (with leather armor or half-plate).
    • Oh, and here's another +2 AC?
    • "per long rest"
    • Don't have +5 to an attack roll. Use advantage. 5e eliminates stacking d20 bonuses as much as possible.
  • Multiclassing. Prerequisite ability scores should be odd numbered.
  • All the features are combat related. There are no exploration or interaction features.

In summary, this is still an unbalanced and poor design, almost everything needs rewriting. Marasmusine (talk) 03:06, 31 July 2017 (MDT)

Also, what are the core concepts of this class? Are you sure they aren't already covered by the fighter class? Marasmusine (talk) 04:09, 31 July 2017 (MDT)
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