Talk:Halo (D20 Modern Campaign Setting)

Rating

I think this CS is now complete enough to have a better rating. What does everybody think? --Sam Kay 03:45, 20 December 2007 (MST)

I have changed it to a 4. --Green Dragon 22:03, 20 December 2007 (MST)

How much more is needed to make it into a 5? --Sam Kay 04:37, 21 December 2007 (MST)

If you feel this deserves a 5 feel free to change it. I did not really look over this CS, I just increased it by a rating based on all the edits I have seen unto this campaign setting on recent changes. It may be worthy of a 5, and I feel that you can be the judge. --Green Dragon 12:11, 24 December 2007 (MST)

I think a 4 is a good rating at the moment. I think what would really make it a 5 is some Halo classes like the Marine and Spartan. I know as soon as someone comes up with the Spartan class I am SO gonna do a Halo campaign! :] --Tommy19 19:10, 27 December 2007 (MST)

Spartan is a "racial template"- you apply it to a human (ignore the fortitude saves for characters starting as spartans), and then take levels in strong, fast or tough hero, then into the soldier advanced class ect. And don't forget your MJOLNIR. Marine would be a soldier. The class that would be good is Arbiter. --Sam Kay 04:26, 28 December 2007 (MST)

In that case I'm going to get started on plans for a campaign then. I'll be sure to let you know how it turns out. :] --Tommy19 14:42, 12 January 2008 (MST)

Are you going to base it on the events of the games, or set it before then? !'d recommend having an all spartan party at at least 5th level (inluding LA). --Sam Kay 14:52, 12 January 2008 (MST)

Not entirely sure about the setting of the game. Like I said, I'm just starting the planning phase. Thanks for the advise on the party. I was figuring on an all spartan party whether I said it or not. lol

Is this forum alive anymore? It seems fairly sparse.

I feel the same way, personally...--Harry Mason 11:53, 25 September 2009 (MDT)

I'm not sure what you mean by forum, but the wiki is active. If you have questions that aren't being answered about a particular article (i.e. this campaign setting) just MOI a user to make sure no one misses it. Really big website = questions can fall thru the cracks.   Hooper   talk    contribs    email   12:16, 25 September 2009 (MDT)

We are now about to embark on our first HALO campaign. As I come up with stats for everything well be fighting I feel obliged to post them on the (very sparse) creatures section of this campaign setting. As usual I don't want to annoy any of the original creators of this material so Sam Kay I give you full editing power over anything I post here. (I know you do anyway but I don't want you to feel like you need to ask me before editing my work) Just please leave a reason for why you edited it! Thanks! --Owen

Thanks

Soon to be Adding to the Halo D20 Modern Campaign Section. Mad props and kudos to whomever started this fantastically, epic home brew. I'm not sure to thank but believe me your are truly my hero! What you have created here is quite comprehensive, yet seems to be lacking in just a little "flavor". Over the next few days I well be adding and subtracting from what you have created in hope to create something more dynamic for my campaign as well as others. I wish for the creator and anyone else who has used this guide in their campaign to contact me in order to contribute ideas via e-mail or from this site. Thanks again to the bad a*# or bad a*#es who started the Halo D20 Campaign! --Theilluminati1369 02:00, 3 December 2009 (MST)

Halo Reach

I hope the Halo:Reach stuff gets added

Rating

What's the difference between a 4 and a 5? In my mind, a 5 is "enough to use, without having to ask for clarifications or make up details", and this setting doesn't qualify. Granted it's the most complete d20 Modern campaign setting currently on the wiki, but there are quite a few important details missing (classes, feats, NPCs, adventures, environments, and guidelines are all blank; background is an outside link to another wiki, and all equipment, while extensive, relies on outside links for everything but mechanics), and much of the existing material (equipment for sure, as I have been going over that), is missing nitty-gritty details that keep it from being a true "5".

*Thinks about it for a couple minutes* Actually, now that I think about it, I'd almost call it a 2 or 3; the only aspect that makes it to 4 is equipment, and everything else is lucky to get a 1. The original author is no longer an editor on this wiki, so it's not likely to get an overhaul any time soon. JazzMan 04:21, 29 March 2010 (UTC)

Well there are plenty of other people here so we can work on it. I have been contributing so a few more people and this may be enough to rate it back up to a five star. Go ahead and re-rate it if you think it's necissary as long as you check on it every once and a while for improvements. --Owen 16:10, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

I know that it's being worked on, but in my opinion a rating should be based on current state and updated. What do you think it should be rated? I'll ask GD as well for his input. JazzMan 17:06, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

I see that it was changed to a 2. If it is missing things then that only makes sense. I wish that ratings were like the improving, removing, and removal templates with that a reason was required, but that is another discussion. --Green Dragon 03:08, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

It's not in the template, but here's my reasoning: at the time, the Classes, Feats, NPCs, Adventures, Environments, and Guideline pages were all blank, and there was no background material hosted on this wiki. The only thing this campaign actually has are some stat blocks. The Russian has been working on this recently so hopefully it will move up quickly. JazzMan 03:15, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

Higher Level?

I noticed that a lot of stuff (NPCs and enemies) are fairly low leveled, and I've been working on some higher leveled content. I've tweaked some classes, weapons, and such. For example, an ODST (with levels in an ODST class I made) is on average around level 15, and a SPARTAN, Brute, or Elite of sufficient rank would definitely be Epic leveled. So, would I make a separate setting (to avoid power level overlap) or add it to this one (since its still HALO)? - The Russian10:02, 27 May 2010 (EST)

As long as the core mechanics are the same, it's probably better to keep it all together. The downside (for you) is that you'll want to make sure your higher powered counterparts are consistent with what's already there. In other words, there's nothing wrong with having a Brute and a Brute, High Level in the same campaign (sorry if that's not the right terminology; never played Halo), so long as the High Level Brute is just that: a higher-powered version of the original creature.

Now if you were thinking of giving the higher leveled stuff completely different abilities, you might then consider creating a different campaign setting, calling it "Halo, Variant" or "Halo, High Powered". But since this campaign, as it is, doesn't really have anyone actively taking control over it, you might as well mold it to fit what you want to do. JazzMan 15:16, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

It would be an almost complete retooling, there would be some semblance to what it is no, but a CR2 Elite? It just seems to be (knowing the games and a couple of the books) that this setting his horrendously underpowered. So I have permission to refit this setting? Or would you suggest leaving this for a lower power and creating a higher powered setting? The Russian 11:42, 27 May 2010 (EST)

Well, unless Halo is based off of the d20 system, CR is really arbitrary. They might be super powerful in the game, but if you are only level 1 then everything seems super powerful, especially if they have better equipment. Also, there's also an Elite Major which is CR 8 and the Elite Zealot is CR 12; are that more in line with what you were thinking?

I think this should be the deciding factor: if you created your own campaign, would you still use the same equipment and vehicles? If yes, then you might as well just retool this campaign setting. But instead of upping the CR, I would strongly consider just making higher powered alternates. Unlike video games, a campaign setting is used across various power levels, so the lower level stuff is still useful, even though you might be starting your campaign at level 15. Even the main characters on Halo had to start on level 1, right? (And I don't actually know what an Elite is, but I'm guessing it wasn't born CR 8).

If you think you need to retool the all equipment and vehicles, then you might as well just make a new campaign setting. I'd really not prefer to have another new campaign setting while this one is sitting unfinished, but if you can't use it you can't use it. JazzMan 16:09, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

I would be changing stats for the weapons, and things like that. And yes, while there are higher CR variants, a super soldier that is biologically altered, in power armor (a 7 foot walking tank) that has decades of combat experience and training, but has trouble hand to hand fighting one elite in the book. Seems higher than a low level game, no? The Russian 13:22, 27 May 2010 (EST)

Decades of combat experience = they started at lower level. What if someone wants to run a prequel to that book? They should be able to use this campaign setting, which describes the entire Halo Universe, not have to create their own. Also equipment doesn't change CR, it changes EL, so it doesn't matter if they have power armor or not. And again, levels are arbitrary. A "super soldier" could be level 3 -- that's higher than anything that exists in real life. And a level 3 would not only have "trouble" in hand-to-hand combat against a CR 12, but would in fact be pummeled by a CR 12. Especially if said creature had superior armor and weaponry.

A campaign setting should set "power levels", meaning starting ability scores, HP per level, maybe some house ruled bonuses, but a campaign setting does not set "playing level". (The adventures do that, and there currently are none). If Halo is a high powered campaign then make sure players start out with a high point buy, have access to lots of equipment, and maybe write some custom feats that are more powerful than core. But starting your campaign at 10th level is an arbitrary choice by the GM, it is not a measure of "power".

Just use your best judgment here. The original author is no longer here, and nobody else has taken control, so the campaign is up for grabs. If you want to retool the equipment to do more damage, then go ahead and do that (though guns don't scale with level, so this should have nothing to do with campaign "level"). While you're at it, a lot of them need cleanup work anyway &emdash; for example, most of them are listed as PL 5 because there's no description, but they all deal too much damage to be considered PL 5 weapons. Also, none of them use the (newly created) d20 Modern Equipment Preload, and very few of them have any non-mechanical descriptions or even a picture.

And there are lots of other things missing from this campaign setting as well: there's no background material, no adventures, no character guides, no NPCs; nothing needed if you actually want to run this campaign. There's a ton of room to work here.

If you do decide to fix this campaign instead of starting a new one, I would ask that you keep with the spirit of the original campaign and keep what's already there, because people might currently be running or want to run a lower level campaign. Having a low-powered creature does not stop you from running a high-powered campaign.

The thing I really want to avoid, and the thing that plagues this site (particularly the d20 Modern side; the red-headed stepchild of D&DWiki), is two sets of half-completed Halo equipment, creatures, and so-on. One set is bad enough... JazzMan 18:18, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

I agree, and I realize there is a distinct preference in that some players and GMs prefer lower level games and other prefer higher levels from my time playing D&D and d20 Modern. I'll rework the weapons, and do as much as I can.

But the simple fact of the universe is that even the lowest ranks of the Elite and Brute warriors were far superior to a UNSC Marine or UNSC Army Soldier. The SPARTAN-IIs were born in 2511 and were augmented in 2525 (age 14), and the Human-Covenant War started later in that same year, so a prequel would be the characters fighting against or as Insurrectionists. The Covenant attacked a colony and while Humanity won first and frequently in the beginning, the Covenant ended up destroying all but less than a dozen colonies over the next 28 years when the war ended in 2553. Yes, the Spartans, Elites, Brutes, etc did start at level 1, but by the time they were combatants (Elites in particular, as they rose in rank based on kill count basically, with some of the highest ranks with a million kills easily under their belts), so it is possible the lowest rank Elite or Brute to be a difficult encounter for a lower leveled character, but you had Grunts and Jackals who were never a huge issue basically because their effectiveness was based on their equipment, which only got better as rank increased. So the easiest thing for lower level campaign (and one set of enemies) would be to back off on the number of elites and keep their ranks lower, which in my mind could limit the possibility of the epic adventure until they reach a higher level. (I guess something like not sending a buck private on a spec ops mission in real life...)

I understand where you are coming from, and to a point I agree, but knowing the setting a compromise will have to be made, and I accept the help if it will be offered. The Russian 19:29, 27 May 2010 (EST)

Before I get ahead of myself, what kind of CRs are we actually talking here? d20 Modern doesn't technically have epic, so we should try and scale it down if we can. Level 20 vs. CR 30 is approximately the same difficulty as a Level 10 vs. CR 20 or Level 1 vs. CR 5-7. JazzMan 00:55, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

It would probably 20+ for some of the more powerful enemies and some of the Spartans. Even a few human NPCs have hit 15, 16 or even 18. But I agree that it can be scaled down, yet I don't think it should be. I say this because there are a lot of epic moments in the HALO universe that just couldn't be fulfilled by a level 3 Spartan hero. But thats just my opinion. The Russian 10:39, 28 May 2010 (EST)

Ok, but if you are expecting to do "epic" things throughout your entire career then you'd better put down your pen and paper and pick up a game console, because d20 Modern just doesn't work that way :) Level 3's too low, I agree (I like to start my games at 6), but on the other hand if you start at level 20 there's nowhere to go. I was thinking 5 or 10, depending on the spread of CRs.

I guess there's two ways to think about it: set the minimum CR and work up, or set the maximum CR and work down. The highest that exists in the MSRD is 17 (not counting for level advancement). Actually I was surprised to find that there's 1 CR 17, 1 CR 15, 1 CR 13, 2 or 3 12's and easily 90% of creatures are lower than 10; I figured there would be a lot more high-level stuff. Arcana's highest is 35 (Advanced Nuclear Toxyderm, a walking nuclear bomb), followed by 26 (Dragon Emperor/Empress; Advanced Chemical Toxyderm). I don't know how powerful a Brute is, but unless it has some sort of extraordinary abilities or something, I can't see it being more powerful than the most powerful dragon. Poking around the currently existing creatures it seems like everything, with exception of the Flood, relies on weapons and armor for it's power.

So unless I'm reading this wrong, it looks like the best thing would be to have a few creatures in the range 20-25, representing the most powerful of the most powerful (and since they can always tack on more levels, it's easy for GMs to raise the level higher if they house-rule and epic progression). The majority would be between 10-20, with the rest between 5-10. That, to me, sounds like something that's playable at reasonable levels, but falls into the spirit of your high-level campaign. Am I close? JazzMan 16:52, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

Trust me I know the difference between pen and paper and console play, but it does get ridiculous as I'm sure you know (We've played a game at level 70 once in 3.5e, :) ) But yes, you are reasonable (and honestly I was thinking along the same lines for the CRs)as the highest leveled enemies are rare and maybe work in small groups when encountered. Mostly you would probably have 3-7 CR 3-5s with one CR 10-12, in that you would have 3 to 7 Jackals and Grunts to on Brute or Elite squad leader, though the level varies for the leader as they structure of the Covenant is funny in that lower leveled Elites were leaders of Jackal/Grunts typically but Brutes squad leaders did run the gambit of levels/ranks (CR 10-20). So I'll get to work on retooling weapons/armor/equipment first. Since they aren't PL5 weapons I'll be tweaking the damage a little. Then I'll get to work on enemies and some classes for higher powered games. The Russian 20:16, 28 May 2010 (EST)

Sounds like a plan. I can't help you with anything Halo-y but if you need wiki or d20 help I'll be glad to lend a hand. JazzMan 00:25, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

I'll probably take you up on that.The Russian 10:00, 30 May 2010 (EST)