Talk:Master Of Ceremonies (5e Class)

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The Peoples' Bastion can grant an AC that goes off the proverbial chart. At 12th level I could hire some cheap soldiers and be in a rank-and-file unit of (conservatively) 16 men. With scale mail, that gives me an AC of 24 to 26, and they all get +2 AC? This is in a game system where +1 AC is nice, +2 is great, and +3 is amazing. Marasmusine (talk) 15:17, 22 April 2016 (MDT)

Christ, this class is becoming the defensive version of what Master of Swords was. Where that used to be unstoppable, this can't be hurt, espcially with the extra HP that just got added and the literal assload of AC. I call BS on what should be allowed, if a class can gain this much health and AC just from standing around, why can't another do the same with damage. Grimeagle4 (talk) 11:27, 4 July 2016 (MDT)
Unfortunately almost every part of this is poorly designed. Half of the problem is sloppy terminology, the other half is runaway bonuses (you can get an AC of 30 or more). Marasmusine (talk) 15:04, 4 July 2016 (MDT)

Let me be clearer on the problem.

  • First of all, it's bad enough that this class has d12 hit dice and has heavy armor and shields.
  • Perfect Training. equipment doesn't "increase your AC past your base". Armor gives you a set value, whilst shields give you a bonus and magic items might give you a bonus. At my nearest guess:
    • Plate Armour goes from AC 18 to AC 22. (since plate armor is 8 past the "base" of 10)
    • Shields go from +2 AC to +3 AC.
    • At first level, you can have an AC of 22 (chain mail and shield), which is ridiculous.
  • Power Through Unison. Do not make class features depend on party size: this punishes players in small groups, and overpowers players in large groups. Anyhoo: In a typical party of 4-5, my d12 great axe at 2nd level is dealing 3d12 damage, on every strike. This is ridiculous.
  • Companion's Tutelage. Which proficiencies? Languages? Tools? Saving throws? Weapons? Skills?
  • The Best Defense. This class already starts with all three armor proficiencies.
    • Given a Constitution of 18, I get a +2 bonus to AC. By now I probably have plate armor, so my AC is 27.
  • Stand For Them. What is that I'm re-rolling? Can I put something personal in a little cart and drag it 10 feet behind me to get re-rolls all the time and advantage on all saving throws?
  • The People's Bastion. So my AC is now 29. This is not including the AC bonus from magic items I might have. In case you're not keeping track, an ancient gold dragon has an AC of 22.
  • I can go into more detail about the poor design and/or wording of the paths, if requested. Marasmusine (talk) 16:11, 15 July 2016 (MDT)

How is it that this class has been given the all clear just because it's specified that it *is* in fact op. The demigod race was fine because it lets you still have a variance of races, but this, we would have to relook at other classes in the not-OKed area, because if we're allowing op classes through, then more of them should be allowed. Like Warmaster for example, it has less AC than this class, but it's basically the masochistic dps equivalent. Grimeagle4 (talk) 11:39, 17 July 2016 (MDT)

All the editors, including you, are responsible for giving things an "all clear". If you see a problem with a page, put the needsbalance template on it. The needsbalance message I put up was removed with these changes, so now we review it again. Marasmusine (talk) 12:48, 17 July 2016 (MDT)
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